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INFO-ATARI16 Digest         Fri, 27 Apr 90       Volume 90 : Issue  486
 
Today's Topics:
                         GDOS and WORDUP 3.0
                        MT C-Shell and Laser C
                 STE TOS / TOS 1.4/1.6 etc. (2 msgs)
                        Unix Windows (2 msgs)
                          UUCP for Atari ST
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Date: Fri, 27 Apr 90 20:03:22 EST
From: "Gerry Greenberg: 315-443-5378"
 <MAXG%SUVM.BITNET@CORNELLC.cit.cornell.edu>
Subject: GDOS and WORDUP 3.0
 
A while back I posted a question to the net about the possible coming of
a new GDOS (something I read in Current Notes).  I asked if anyone knew
anything about that, because I was wondering whether or not to buy
G+Plus with a new GDOS on the horizon.  Well, it looks like I don't have
to think about this any longer.  The only program I use that makes use
of GDOS is WordUp.  I got my 3.0 upgrade info in the mail today and
guess what?  -- WordUp 3.0 doesn't use GDOS!  or at least that is what I
understand from the flier...here is what it says:
"Word Up bypasses GDOS and automatically loads one the printer fonts
needed for printing a particular document.  The screen fonts will be
temporarily unloaded while printing if you are short on memory.  Thus,
Word Up no longer suffers from the severe memory limitations that plague
other GDOS programs.  We have simplified the method of adding fonts,
avoiding the ASSIGN.SYS file altogether, so as font sets are released it
will be practical (even for a 520ST/1040ST users) to have multitudes of
fonts installed with Word Up."
Well, what do you think?  Does that mean no GDOS at all with Word Up?
I'm going to get the upgrade in any event (there are quite a lot of
improvements, it seems)...but at least I don't have to get G+Plus as
well, I guess.
---Gerry
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 27 Apr 90 23:08:08 GMT
From: unisoft!bdt!david@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU  (David Beckemeyer)
Subject: MT C-Shell and Laser C
Message-ID: <2349@bdt.UUCP>
 
Someone already had written scripts for using Laser C with MT C-Shell
and posted them to my BBS, but I forgot about it.  The BBS number is
(415) 530-9682. The files are in the SCRIPTS file area.  I could also
mail them to people who are interested.
 
--
David Beckemeyer (david@bdt.UUCP)       | "I'll forgive you Dad...  If you have
Beckemeyer Development Tools            | a breath mint."
P.O. Box 21575, Oakland, CA 94620       |    Bart - "The Simpsons"
UUCP: ?uunet,ucbvax?!unisoft!bdt!david  |
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 28 Apr 90 00:20:01 GMT
From: oahu.cs.ucla.edu!stephen@cs.ucla.edu  (Steve Whitney)
Subject: STE TOS / TOS 1.4/1.6 etc.
Message-ID: <34769@shemp.CS.UCLA.EDU>
 
In article <1990Apr27.185702.10436@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu>
 cmm1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Christopher M Mauritz) writes:
-The basenote said something about how Atari wasn't in the developer
-support (HA!) area for their health and that anyone wanting
-detailed (HA!) information should become a registered developer.
-Doesn't it stand to reason that Atari could benefit far more by
-providing copious amounts of information about TOS at a reasonable
-price to a larger audience rather than releasing an expensive box
-of outdated photocopies?  [more follows]
 
(The following refers to the atari developer program in the US; things may
be different elsewhere)
 
From what I've been told, much of the second or third generation photocopied
documentation that was originally part of the developers' kit has been
rewritten and updated.  I also know for a fact (since I am a registered
developer and have the stuff) that many new documents have been written and
distributed to _all_ registered developers.  Your point may be that the
documentation is not in bound book form or even binder (until the TOS 1.4
notes), and if it is, you are correct, but thinkgs aren't the same  as they
were as couple of years ago.
 
As far as support from Atari goes, it has _greatly_ improved.  The newsletters
have been arriving monthly since December, and documentaion and disks with
tools, examples, and useful information have been packed in with them.
 
Finally, Atari's software engineers have regularly been posting their ideas
on the ATARIDEV roundtable on GEnie to give registered developers a chance
to review them and give feedback.
 
In my opinion, the only part of Atari that _hasn't_ changed for the better
(and the changes have been remarkable) is the part that [suposedly] markets
Atari products.  Perhaps we'll see a change there too as products become
available in the US.  Supposedly new FCC-passed STEs are on their way  to
the United States right now.  Watch for 'em!
 
-                               It seems to me that the ultimate success
-of a machine has a lot more to do with the number of people and
-quality of people writing software for it.  What sense does it make
-to rape a few thousand people for developer docs when you could
-sell them more cheaply and get more people to write programs
-for your machine.  Without software, the machine will die and the
-$10-20,000 you earned on selling those photocopies will not mean
-much anymore.
 
No argument there.  I don't think Atari is trying to _make_ money on the
developer kits, but partly the money is a way of attempting to weed out those
who are "documentation junkies" and aren't actually trying to develop the
programs to which you refer.
 
-
-Chris
-
-------------------------------+---------------------------
-Chris Mauritz                 |Where there's a BEER,
-cmm1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu   |there's a plan.
-(c)All rights reserved.       |
-Send flames to /dev/null      |Air Warrior is king!
-------------------------------+---------------------------
 
 
--
Steve Whitney   "It's never _really_ the last minute"       (())_-_(())
UCLA Comp. Sci. Grad. Student                                | (* *) |
Internet: stephen@cs.ucla.edu              UCLA Bruin-->    ?  \_@_/  ?
GEnie:    S.WHITNEY                                           `-----'
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 28 Apr 90 00:21:20 GMT
From: fernwood!portal!atari!apratt@apple.com  (Allan Pratt)
Subject: STE TOS / TOS 1.4/1.6 etc.
Message-ID: <2180@atari.UUCP>
 
rjd@cs.brown.edu (Rob Demillo) writes:
 
> In article <2178@atari.UUCP| apratt@atari.UUCP (Allan Pratt) writes:
 
>> I don't think it's wise to publish what you learned from the ROMs.
>> [I go on to show "the inherent weakness of this kind of analysis."]
 
> This is ridiculous. There may be inherent *legalities* about
> publishing a dismantled ROM, but there is no "inherent weakness"
> in this kind of analysis. It is merely very difficult.
 
I think you are wrong. You can learn only so much from the ROM. You can
learn what the ROM code does, and how it does it.  But you can't learn
things that the ROM code DOESN'T do.  You won't learn the right way to
interact with the DMA Sound chip (the ROM doesn't use it). You won't
learn about ARGV or the functional limits of the cookie jar (that
accessories can't use it).
 
You *will* learn things which just happen to be true, but which aren't
guaranteed.  You will learn that calling the BIOS with an invalid
function number returns different things depending on the number.  You
will learn the addresses and uses of variables and data structures.
It's not a secret, it's just that we need to be free to change those
things in the future.  If your program relies on something stupid and
becomes popular, we could get stuck with a feature we don't like, a
feature YOU don't like and didn't realize was outside the "rules" for
well-behaved programs.
 
THAT'S why it's dangerous to disassemble the ROMs and take lessons
from what you find.
 
[Flame on]
 
This kind of analysis is not that hard, folks.  Please think a little
before posting stuff.  I'm not stupid.  When I say something, I usually
have reasoned it out a little.  If you think about starting a posting
by calling my arguments ridiculous, maybe it's because YOU haven't
thought through the implications of what was said or my response.
 
[Flame off]
 
============================================
Opinions expressed above do not necessarily     -- Allan Pratt, Atari Corp.
reflect those of Atari Corp. or anyone else.      ...ames!atari!apratt
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 27 Apr 90 21:21:27 GMT
From:
 sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!xanth!cs.odu.edu!a
 ustin@ucsd.edu  (Jason C Austin)
Subject: Unix Windows
Message-ID: <12351@xanth.cs.odu.edu>
 
        I was looking through the atari archives at panarthea and
found what looks to be a very interesting program called Unix Windows.
If I'm reading things right, this program will allow the opening of
several windows, each containing a different process, while logged
into a UNIX system over a modem.  The only problem is the program is
only the client side of the package and didn't say were the UNIX host
program might be found.  Is the host side a commercial program or is
it available from an ftp site somewhere?
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 28 Apr 90 02:57:40 GMT
From:
 sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!uwm.edu!ux1.cso.uiuc.edu!cs325ec@ucsd.edu
 (Gregory Lemperle-Kerr)
Subject: Unix Windows
Message-ID: <1990Apr28.025740.26620@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu>
 
austin@cs.odu.edu (Jason C Austin) writes:
 
 
>       I was looking through the atari archives at panarthea and
>found what looks to be a very interesting program called Unix Windows.
>If I'm reading things right, this program will allow the opening of
>several windows, each containing a different process, while logged
>into a UNIX system over a modem.  The only problem is the program is
>only the client side of the package and didn't say were the UNIX host
>program might be found.  Is the host side a commercial program or is
>it available from an ftp site somewhere?
 
        I have seen it recently at terminator in unix/ or at
sumex.stanford.edu in unix/...
 
-- Greg
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 28 Apr 90 02:20:17 GMT
From: njin!lodzins@rutgers.edu  (Dean Lodzinski)
Subject: UUCP for Atari ST
Message-ID: <Apr.27.22.20.17.1990.6624@pilot.njin.net>
 
I recently received a UUCP archive for the Atari ST.  The program is
by John Logajan and released in the Public Domain.  It is version 1.1.
The MAILTRUK file has an error and I was wondering if someone could
tell me where I can get another copy.  The code is in GFA Basic 2.0.
The error is a WEND without a WHILE.
 
I would also like to know, if I ever get the programs to work, where I
can call to test it out.  Does anyone know of any UUCP sites in the
New Jersey area?  I am not too familiar with this, so any information
would be appreciated.
--
 
Dean Lodzinski         CSRA19@TURBO.Kean.edu, lodzins@pilot.njin.net
47 Mercury Circle      Dean Lodzinski on FoReM FNET at node 133
South Amboy, NJ  08879
USA
 
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End of INFO-ATARI16 Digest V90 Issue #486
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