Info-Atari16 Digest   Friday, August 25, 1989   Volume 89 : Issue 413
 
This weeks Editor: Bill Westfield
 
Today's Topics:
 
                     Re: New Atari 68030 Machines
                       Re: Apathy and Defeatism
                Re: QUESTION ABOUT SEAGATE HARD DRIVE
              Re: How to find bad sectors on Hard Disk?
                     Re: New Atari 68030 Machines
              Buying an ST in Europe for US  - should I?
                            System2/Chaos
                       Comments on your machine
                     Re: Designing HIs under GEM
                       1 Meg Atari ST for sale
                          Re: Norad binary ?
                           c-shell's, RCS?
                 Need help with writing MIDI software
          Re: HELP IDENTIFYING SEAGATE 296N WITH REV. 7 ROM
                     Re: Designing HIs under GEM
 
----------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Date: 19 Aug 89 03:28:49 GMT
From: portal!cup.portal.com!Xorg@uunet.uu.net  (Peter Ted Szymonik)
Subject: Re: New Atari 68030 Machines
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
 
<sorry, mailer ills>
 
A standard Mega keyboard or an enhanced keyboard as a option.
 
Peter Szymonik
Xorg@cup.portal.com
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 19 Aug 89 03:19:07 GMT
From: portal!cup.portal.com!Xorg@uunet.uu.net  (Peter Ted Szymonik)
Subject: Re: Apathy and Defeatism
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
 
The Fortune 500 list is as of THIS year, and does account for
the dumping of Federated.
 
Peter Szymonik
Xorg@cup.portal.com
 
(moving up the Fortune 500 while dealing with the Federated fiasco
 speaks volumes about the strength of Atari Corp.)
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 19 Aug 89 03:37:55 GMT
From: portal!cup.portal.com!Xorg@uunet.uu.net  (Peter Ted Szymonik)
Subject: Re: QUESTION ABOUT SEAGATE HARD DRIVE
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
 
The Seagate SCSI 296N <- imbedded controller, is the one which I have heard
the most complaints about - ask for ROM7 (older) ROM8 is the one used to
slow the drive so it can't be formatted at 1:1.
 
Peter Szymonik
Xorg@cup.portal.com
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 19 Aug 89 03:32:14 GMT
From: portal!cup.portal.com!Xorg@uunet.uu.net  (Peter Ted Szymonik)
Subject: Re: How to find bad sectors on Hard Disk?
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
 
This may be a weird way to find bad sectors, but MichTron's Tune-Up
program can show a box will shaded areas showing used sectors, if you have
bad sectors you will get 'spots' in this pict after you format the
partition!  I used this to find a nasty scratch on my hard drive surface
caused by a crashed head - looked like this:
 
                   ..
                     ...
                        ..
                          ....
                               (etc)
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 19 Aug 89 03:27:35 GMT
From: portal!cup.portal.com!Xorg@uunet.uu.net  (Peter Ted Szymonik)
Subject: Re: New Atari 68030 Machines
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
 
August 25th is slated as the day Atari Corp. announces its new products,
including the '030 machine.  A major ad campaign which is being handled
by the same ad firm which did the MacIntosh Olympic ads is also slated
to start this Fall - the money has beenspent - the ads WILL appear.
Accordin to Sam Tramiel in this month's START the '030 (aka TT) will
come in many onfigurations, one being a 6 meg machine which will have
TOS 1.4 built-in, will run UNIX 5.3.1 as a $299 add-on option and will
aslo emulate MS-DOS (and the Mac no doubt with Dave Small's Spectre GCR.)
Sam claims plenty of expandability (hurray!) with six or mor VME full
size VME slots.  It can be mated to a multi-sync as well as 'slightly
adjusted' VGA color and mono monitors.  The TT will offer a standard
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 18 Aug 89 21:24:16 GMT
From: att!tsdiag!pedsga!mikes@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU  (Mike Shulman)
Subject: Buying an ST in Europe for US  - should I?
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
 
Hello everyone!
 
  I've been considering getting a mega ST for a while now. Well, next week
I will be going to Germany for 2 weeks and I was wondering....
I've heard that ST's are MUCH cheaper in Germany then in US. Is that
true? If it is, would it take much to get a German-made ST to work in US?
Would it simply involve moving some jumper on the mother board from 50
to 60 Hz? What about the monitor (color and mono)? I presume all the docs
will be in German, but I guess I could photocopy them from somebody here
in US. What about OS prompts, error messages, etc. Will they all be in
German as well? Can that be changed?
  Is there anything else I am missing? Does anybody know what's the
$ limit on "souvenirs" you can bring back to US before you have to pay a
tarrif?
  These questions are probably just hypothetical, since after paying
for this Europe trip I will not be able to afford a new computer.
(Unless one of you German STers can recommend a REALLY cheap store
that takes credit cards. I will definitely be in Frankfurt and Berlin.
I'll also be traveling all over Europe on Eurail pass, so no city
is out of reach!)
 
Thanks in advance for your responses!
                                            Mike
--
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mike Shulman                         <Insert your favorite disclaimer here>
UUCP: princeton!rutgers!petsd!pedsga!mikes
Internet: mikes@tinton.ccur.com
 
------------------------------
 
Date:     Sat, 19 AUG 89 14:04:15 GMT
From:     WILDDJ%VAXB.ASTON.AC.UK@Forsythe.Stanford.EDU
To:       info-atari16@SCORE.STANFORD.EDU
Subject:  System2/Chaos
 
Just thought I'd write to the net about a couple of things...
 
1. I've started to update my System2 shell. I *think* i've included GEM
support - all it does is clear the screen, turn cursor off & put mouse on.
Nothing else is required is it? (these are restored afterwards)
 
2. System2 users - is there anything else you'd desperately like to see in
System2 (not too major, please), while I'm amending it?
 
3. I've written a Fast Basic program for Chos investigation - bifurcation,
etc. Is anyone interested? I can't upload it yet, not until I get back to
Aston University in 5 wks.
 
- Dave Wild
wilddj@uk.ac.aston.vaxb
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 18 Aug 89 19:51:49 GMT
From: att!mtuxo!mtgzz!drutx!dvac@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU  (Daniel Vachon)
Subject: Comments on your machine
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
 
This is cross posted to Amiga and Atari ST boards bacause I am really
curious what the individual machine owners think about their computers.
 
I would appreciate any input from anyone on this matter.  I am currently
an Apple // user (have been for the last 7 years .. religiously!), and
recently I don't care much for Apple's direction on the Apple // line.
I have been seeing Apple //'ers from the past switching to Atari ST's
and Commodore Amigas.   I would like to know the good points and the bad
points about these machines....
 
Mainly the Atari 520ST, the Amiga 500, the Atari 1020ST, and the Amiga 2000.
 
Any info that anyone would be willing to offer would be appreciated.  I am
also somewhat interested in MIDI, and would like to know a bit about the
MIDI interfaces of these machines.  Also, MAC and IBM emulator information
is a lot of help too.   Thanks in advance for any and all help.
 
If anyone would like to get a copy of all the replies I get, let me know and
I will e-mail the synopsis.
 
Later - Dan Vachon -  arpa!att!drutx!dvac
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 18 Aug 89 18:22:08 GMT
From: hpfcdc!hpldola!jg@hplabs.hp.com  (Joe Gilray)
Subject: Re: Designing HIs under GEM
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
 
First, thanks to those of you who have responded to my base note so far.
I look forward to some more interesting discussion.
 
Second, more in the HIs (or do you say GUIs) saga:
 
I wanted to create an FTEXT object which could be used two different
ways.  What I mean is that it could prompt the user for one field or
another.  For example, it might say
                                      Enter Category: ___
at one point or
                                      Name: ___
at another.
 
Note that the number of underscores in both cases is the same,
although in general I don't think they should have to be.
 
I tried to accomplish this in two ways (both really the same in essence):
Method One: copy directly into the Object tree before displaying the tree
    obspec = (TEDINFO *) (tree + THING)->ob_spec;
    strcpy(obspec->te_ptext, "@@@");
    strcpy(obspec->te_ptmplt, "Name: ___");
 
Method Two: (credit to Tim Oren and his PROGEM series) copy into a local
variable and then set Object to point to local variable
    obspec = (TEDINFO *) (tree + THING)->ob_spec;
    strcpy(localtext, "@@@");
        obspec->te_ptext = localtext;
        obspec->te_txtlen = strlen(localtext) + 1;
        strcpy(localtmplt, "Name: ___");
        obspec->te_ptmplt = localtmplt;
        obspec->te_tmplen = strlen(localtmplt) + 1;
 
Note that the te_pvalid string is not touched in either case, it is
left as it is the original Object tree - pointing to "XXX".
 
Neither method works, in both cases it appears that the edit takes
place on the box where the original Object tree thinks it should.
If the original tree had "MMM: ___" as a template and I replace
it (using methods one or two above) with "Name: ___" the dialog
will only show "Name: __" and the cursor will go off the end of
the two shown underscores, also sometimes the system will crash.
If I replace "MMM: ___" with "Name:___" (note missing space)
everything is fine.
 
What am I doing wrong, or not doing.
 
Thanks for any help!
 
Yours,
Joe Gilray
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 19 Aug 89 16:00:04 GMT
From:
 gem.mps.ohio-state.edu!csd4.csd.uwm.edu!lakesys!martin@tut.cis.ohio-state.edu
 (Martin Wiedmeyer)
Subject: 1 Meg Atari ST for sale
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
 
                1 Meg Atari 520ST for Sale
                --------------------------
 
68000 @ 8Mhz
1 Meg RAM (dealer installed piggyback upgrade)
2 DSDD Disk Drives (1 Atari, 1 Tandy)
1 SM124 Monochrome Monitor
1 SC1224 Color Monitor
1 Panasonic KXP-1091 printer
 
Atari Developers Kit w/ Alcyon C & Developers Docs
SYBEX Programmers Guide to GEM
Regent Base
FLASH 1.6
 
MANY, MANY PD programs (I was the moderator of netlib@lakesys)
e.g. gulam, uniterm 2.0e, Sozobon C, GCC, gemstart, QuickST etc.
 
$1000, you pay shipping.
 
I send email to martin@lakesys.lakesys.COM or call (414)963-2182
 
 
        Marty Wiedmeyer
--
 
        Marty Wiedmeyer
 
        martin@lakesys.lakesys.COM
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 19 Aug 89 03:08:10 GMT
From: tank!shamash!nic.MR.NET!ns!logajan@handies.ucar.edu  (John Logajan)
Subject: Re: Norad binary ?
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
 
In article <703@chyde.uwasa.fi>, hv@chyde.uwasa.fi (Harri Valkama LAKE) writes:
> Was norad binaries posted recently to comp.binaries.atari.st
> arriving alright ? What I got here seems to be truncated because
> the last line that was there was 80 characters wide so it was
> a whole line, and there was no 'end'...
 
The copy I got here was okay.  So I have sent you a copy direct. Hope
you get it.  Anyone else need a copy?
 
--
- John M. Logajan @ Network Systems; 7600 Boone Ave; Brooklyn Park, MN 55428  -
- logajan@ns.network.com / ...rutgers!umn-cs!ns!logajan / john@logajan.mn.org -
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 18 Aug 89 21:51:10 GMT
From: telesoft!dar@ucsd.edu  (David Reisner)
Subject: c-shell's, RCS?
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
 
Hi Folks.
 
I'm really more of a Unix programmer, but I'm doing some realtime / signal
processing controlled by an Atari.  I'd very much like to use a full c-shell
and RCS (revision control system) or something similar.  Are there any such
things out there?
 
I've seen and used some version of the Beckmeyer csh - does some stuff OK,
but can't expand *\*, 'foreach' doesn't work, no 'find' ...  Perhaps
Beckmeyer has a newer version, but I don't know how to get in touch with them.
I've also used a vi clone called Z - not real vi, but quite usable.  I
haven't seen anything dealing with version control.
 
Any pointers, especially with phone number or USENET addresses, appreciated.
 
-David
ucsd!telesoft!dar, dar@sdcsvax.ucsd.edu
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 18 Aug 89 10:53:10 GMT
From: mcvax!ukc!dcl-cs!gdt!ccspgo@uunet.uu.net  (Paul Overend)
Subject: Need help with writing MIDI software
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
 
This is a submission for a friend.  Can anyone please recommend a book about
writing a sequencer or MIDI for the atari st (preferably in C).  Any level
would be appreciated.
                        Thanx in advance,
                                   The Outlaw.
 
--
Paul G. Overend                                            ccspgo@uk.ac.bath.gdr
The Outlaw at BUCS                                         ccspgo@uk.ac.bath.gdt
Bath University,England                                       The_Outlaw at BUCS
         ***   A chat with u and somehow death loses its sting!!   ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 20 Aug 89 03:20:33 GMT
From: portal!cup.portal.com!Xorg@uunet.uu.net  (Peter Ted Szymonik)
Subject: Re: HELP IDENTIFYING SEAGATE 296N WITH REV. 7 ROM
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
 
A spec sheet is usually included with new Seagate drives - on there
it will specifically state which ROM's were used - but you can forget
about asking any hard drive distributor to check and see what they are
selling - odd's are that they won't even have a clue what you're talking
about!  Seagate is no help either - they claim that the difference isn't
noticable (ha!)
 
Peter Szymonik
Xorg@cup.portal.com
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 19 Aug 89 03:59:45 GMT
From: hall!rosenkra@UMN-CS.CS.UMN.EDU  (Bill Rosenkranz)
Subject: Re: Designing HIs under GEM
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
 
In article <11830048@hpldola.HP.COM> jg@hpldola.HP.COM (Joe Gilray) writes:
=
=I would like to start a discussion about human interface design under GEM.
 
this should be fun :~)
 
 
=1) Is there any standard "look and feel" for dialog boxes?  More than
=   just Title at the top, buttons across the bottom?  For example
 
what u describe is more like an alert box, which are trivial to use. they
are subsets of dialog boxes and good for yes/no type input. i generally
use them only to warn the user of some condition he should be aware of
(do you REALLY want to quit and loose all your data?).
 
=
=2) I also tend to use nested dialogs quite a bit.  I like to keep the
 
in a word: don't. design your program to have as much information as
possible in one spot, i.e. make it as modeless as possible. if you can
design your program so a user can get from one place to the desired
action in one move, it is far easier to use. in fact, if you can design
your program to have but one evnt_multi loop, it will be very easy
for the user to do what he wants to do, quickly. ST users really
appreciate that. i used to use zillions of alert boxes to tell users
what (i thought) they needed to know. i now opt for an asynchronous
message box in some static location on the screen, always there, which
gives the user info but does not require action (like click or key).
 
=3) One of the reasons I use nested dialogs is a limit I think I've
=   found in GEM, it appears that there must be less than 256 editable
=   (FTEXT, FBOXTEXT) characters per box in GEM.  Has anyone else
=   noticed this (I am using original ROM TOS)?  Is this fixed in
=   QuickSt or TurboSt?
 
i have not heard this and doubt it is true. i can't see how it matters
since the resources are just strings. i have used dialogs with at least
200 objects which to me seemed like a lot, even in a code with over
50000 lines. half of them were FBOXTEXTs. if there is such a limit, it
would be in the form_do code. find tim oren's tutorial series. he has
a form_do source which you can hack if this is in fact the case.
the standard form_do is pretty lame anyway, especially if you do anything
serious (commercial). form_do is ok for run-of-the-mill stuff, but
you'd be better off in the long run rolling your own. besides, you'll
learn more about how things work. i hacked up form-do to do nested
menus (which were just dialogs, one on top of the others).
 
user interface is religion. just ask apple :~) expect this discussion
to get rather bloody...
 
=-Joe Gilray
 
 
-bill rosenkranz
rosenkra@boston.cray.com
 
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End of Info-Atari16 Digest
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