=========================================================================

INFO-ATARI16 Digest         Tue,  5 Dec 89       Volume 89 : Issue 753
 
Today's Topics:
                  Atari ST as video edit controller
                             foldrxxx.prg
                                Form.
                     How random is Atari ST NH3?
                    Rainbow Tos Porblems (2 msgs)
                   Soz C V1.2 Upgrade help required
                          STE vs ST Shifter
                          Still searching...
                           Stunt Car Driver
                          Trash, Disks, etc.
                      What Kermit/UNITERM bugs?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Date: 5 Dec 89 00:19:53 GMT
From: pixar!mike@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU  (Mike Russell)
Subject: Atari ST as video edit controller
Message-ID: <7977@pixar.UUCP>
 
Does anyone have info on a new software product for the Atari
ST that turns it into an edit controller?  I'm sure I saw something
posted recently on this.
--
Mike Russell ucbvax!pixar!mike  When the vark gets ard,
                                the ard get varking.
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 5 Dec 89 08:28:07 GMT
From: sdcc6!sdcc13!pa1562@ucsd.edu  (C. SQuibby Breyman)
Subject: foldrxxx.prg
Message-ID: <5587@sdcc6.ucsd.edu>
 
        Pardon me, but I have a copy of foldrxxx.prg that
        is said to fix the 40 folder bug. Is this true?
        How does one use it?
 
                Thanks in advance,
                                C. Breyman
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Tue, 5 Dec 89  11:03 GMT
From: Jan Ameij <AMEIJ%vax.oxford.ac.uk@NSFnet-Relay.AC.UK>
Subject: Form.
 
Dear Pals,
 
Everyone seems dead keen on this form thingy and I don't know how to get it.
Can anyone give me some pointers? Just to spice things up, I have no access
to panarthea, comp.binaries, uucp or in fact anything outside Europe to
speak of. In short, how would some nice person like to mail me the thing?
Please email first to arrange it, as I have a feeling it's a tad big, and
I'd rather not receive a dozen....
 
Thanks very much
 
Jan Ameij
Oxford University Department of Applied Metaphysics
 
ameij@uk.ac.oxford.vax
 
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 5 Dec 89 00:21:03 GMT
From: mailrus!uwm.edu!rpi!crdgw1!ge-dab!peora!cmpfen!bob@tut.cis.ohio-state.edu
 (Bob Breum)
Subject: How random is Atari ST NH3?
Message-ID: <273@cmpfen.UUCP>
 
I play NH3 on both an AT&T 3B1 and an Atari ST.  My 3B1 NH3 is version
3.0e, and the ST version is the binary which was posted to the net.
When I play the Atari version, it seems that the creation of new items
is not entirely random, e.g., if I start with potions X and Y, and
rings A and B, then the odds are that I will find more of each of
these in the first level or two.  This, of course, is fine if I start
with a scroll of genocide or a wand of death, but not especially
beneficial if I find more rings of hunger or potions of hallucination.
I don't observe this behavior in my 3B1 NH3.  Is the Atari ST version
using a less than perfectly random number generator, or is this just
my imagination?  Has anybody else observed this phenomenon?
 
--
Computer Fenestrations                                                Bob Breum
Post Office Box 151             ?uiucuxc|hoptoad|petsd|ucf-cs?!peora!cmpfen!bob
Lake Monroe, FL 32747 USA
+1 407 322-3222 (if a modem answers, try 322-2002)         "C is the new BASIC"
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 4 Dec 89 20:28:27 GMT
From: imagen!atari!kbad@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU  (Ken Badertscher)
Subject: Rainbow Tos Porblems
Message-ID: <1851@atari.UUCP>
 
gilmore@vms.macc.wisc.edu (Neil Gilmore) writes:
| What's a local dealer?
| (this prevents me from even thinking about the upgrade)
 
Think again.  Atari has a service in place for users who don't have
dealers near them to get the Rainbow TOS upgrade installed.  Call Atari
Customer Service for information on how to get the upgrade.
 
--
   |||   Ken Badertscher  (ames!atari!kbad)
   |||   Atari R&D System Software Engine
  / | \  #include <disclaimer>
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 5 Dec 89 00:55:34 GMT
From: imagen!atari!towns@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU  (John Townsend)
Subject: Rainbow Tos Porblems
Message-ID: <1860@atari.UUCP>
 
in article <2753@dogie.macc.wisc.edu>, gilmore@vms.macc.wisc.edu (Neil Gilmore)
 says:
>
> What's a local dealer?
>
> (this prevents me from even thinking about the upgrade)
> +-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
> | Kitakaze Tatsu Raito        Neil Gilmore     internet:gilmore@macc.wisc.edu |
> | Jararvellir,          MACC, UW-Madison bitnet: gilmore@wiscmac3       |
> | Middle Kingdom        Madison, Wi                                     |
> +-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
 
If you call Customer Relations and speak with them, they can direct you to
the location that can help you. The phone number for Customer Relations is
(408)745-2367.
 
-- John
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 4 Dec 89 20:34:20 GMT
From: imagen!atari!kbad@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU  (Ken Badertscher)
Subject: Soz C V1.2 Upgrade help required
Message-ID: <1852@atari.UUCP>
 
steve@thelake.UUCP (Steve Yelvington) writes:
| Under (almost) no circumstances should you try to use any of the Sozobon
| programs directly from the Desktop. In this example, how are cc and make
| supposed to know where to find hcc, top, ld and jas? They look at the
| environment, which is for all practical purposes the dark side of the moon
| if you run from the Desktop.
 
Honk!  There's a program, SETENV or somesuch, which sets the
environment up for the desktop, and hence for all of it's children.  It
can be useful for people (like me) who _like_ to use the Desktop.  I
don't know if this program is in any of the archives of comp.binaries
or comp.sources, but it should be.  I got it off of BIX, I believe.
And then there's the mythical DA environment setter I was working on
which got mowed over by TT TOS for the time being...
 
| In addition to providing a proper environment string, Gulam (or any other
| competent shell) will pass arguments to the Sozobon compiler and utilities
| without mangling them. GEM Desktop uppercases everything [...]
 
The Desktop stopped doing that as of Mega TOS.  Rainbow TOS doesn't mangle
args in the TTP box either.  Yet Another Reason To Get Rainbow TOS.
YARTGRT?  nevermind..
--
   |||   Ken Badertscher  (ames!atari!kbad)
   |||   Atari R&D System Software Engine
  / | \  #include <disclaimer>
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 4 Dec 89 08:58:31 GMT
From: mcsun!ukc!edcastle!hwcs!neil@uunet.uu.net  (Neil Forsyth)
Subject: STE vs ST Shifter
Message-ID: <3868@brahma.cs.hw.ac.uk>
 
In article <20157@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU> soohoo@cory.Berkeley.EDU (Ken "nmi"
Soohoo) writes:
>There's been quite a few ponderings in the last few days about the
>possiblity of an STE shifter that's pin-pin compadible with the
>ST shifter
 
<Details why not deleted>
 
I'm not bothered about SHIFTER, it's MMU I want replaced. No palette changes
just better hardware scrolling.
 
>--Kenneth "kens" Soohoo                (soohoo@cory.Berkeley.Edu)
 
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
! DISCLAIMER: Unless otherwise stated, the above comments are entirely my own !
!                                                                             !
! Neil Forsyth                       JANET:  neil@uk.ac.hw.cs                 !
! Dept. of Computer Science          ARPA:   neil@cs.hw.ac.uk                 !
! Heriot-Watt University             UUCP:   ..!ukc!cs.hw.ac.uk!neil          !
! Edinburgh, Scotland, UK            "spam spaM spAM sPAM SPAM, lovely SPAM"  !
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 4 Dec 89 21:13:13 GMT
From: imagen!atari!kbad@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU  (Ken Badertscher)
Subject: Still searching...
Message-ID: <1854@atari.UUCP>
 
daniel@pkmab.se (Daniel Deimert) writes:
| I can assure you -- you won't be able
| to sell a lot of computers if you don't tell them how to program it!
 
I seriously doubt that the _majority_ of people who buy Atari
computers, or any other computers for that matter, have the slightest
desire to program their machines.  The simple fact is, most people who
buy computers want to _use_ their computers.  They don't want to be
bothered with "programming" the things.  Where a computer company
will lose is if there is no software available for the computers.  It
is important to make sure that professional programmers know how to
program the computers, not end users.
 
| [...] it must be possible to post a minimum of information to some
| knowledgeable people in the right places.
 
Who is "knowledgeable"?  What is "the right place"?  How much
information is "a minimum"?
And what do you call the information we have been posting?
Chopped liver?
 
| And there're a lot of developers on the net, too.
 
In fact, only a tiny percentage of commercial ST developers are active
on the net.
 
| And people from the net DO forward things to the right places.
 
It's true that net.info gets spread around quite a bit.  It's also
true that it gets warped on the way out.  People are misquoted.  The
information may be wrongly interpreted at the far end, with no chance
of the person(s) responsible for the original post to clear up the
mistakes.
 
[interesting chain letter analogy deleted]
 
| It should at least be "cost effective" to give this information to
| developers without them having to ask!
 
Registered developers get a lot of information without having to ask
anything more than "Where's my developer kit?"
 
| Why should I buy a computer I can't use?  Like buying a car and when
| you ask for an explanation of the buttons getting the answer: "Sorry,
| you have to be a registred driver to get to know this.  You shouldn't
| know about more than the gear and the wheel."
 
Why do so many people use this analogy?  A computer is not a car.
A computer is a computer.  But, since you insist, getting technical
information (on a level equivalent to "How do I program DMA sound?")
from an auto manufacturer isn't all that easy either.  Try it some time.
 
| Have nobody thought of the possibility that there might be something
| wrong? Why should we otherwise be bashing Atari?
 
Okay, I'm donning my asbestos suit for this one, but here goes: I think
the reason that people bash Atari is BECAUSE THEY CAN. Because we are
active on the nets answering technical questions, people feel that
their input on how Atari should run its operation will be listened to.
 
WRONG.  The nets are not the right forum for that kind of
communication.  I pass on what I can to TPTB (The Powers That Be) at
Atari, but a lot more credence is (and should be!) placed in letters.
That's right, letters.  On paper.  Sent in envelopes.  Becuause it's
all too easy to sit at your computer reading netnews, and fling a flame
into an electronic message thread without thinking too hard about it.
Most people think a little harder before putting something on paper and
mailing it.
 
| I have offered to help writing some demonstration programs to be put
| on the STE language disk. I haven't even got a reply.   Atari Corp. was
| obviosly not interested.
 
This concerns me.  To whom did you send the offer?  Where did you send
your letter?  Did you send an example program along with your offer?
 
| I do not want Atari Corp. to die [...]
 
Nor do I.  I hope you are able to get the information you want to program
your STE soon.  But remember, Atari gives registered developers special
treatment, and they deserve it, because they write the software that
sells Atari computers.
 
--
   |||   Ken Badertscher  (ames!atari!kbad)
   |||   Atari R&D System Software Engine
  / | \  #include <disclaimer>
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 4 Dec 89 09:25:49 GMT
From: mcsun!ukc!edcastle!hwcs!neil@uunet.uu.net  (Neil Forsyth)
Subject: Stunt Car Driver
Message-ID: <3869@brahma.cs.hw.ac.uk>
 
In article <891202130042340.GKWQ@RAI.CC.FSU.EDU> BAILEYS@FSU.BITNET (NOLES #1)
 writes:
>Anyone looking for a great game to give to themselves for X-mas??  Well, I
>have seen a real doozy!  It's called Stunt Car Driver, and is roughly a
>cross between Falcon and Pole Position.  You are the driver of a stunt car
>in a 3-D gamespace, jumping and swerving, etc.  Excellent graphics, and has
>an option for connecting two ST's via (null) modem for some really good two
>player action.  All in all, worth the price (rare for a game).
>
>Bob Marley
 
I second all of the above! Stunt Car Racer is the best game I have ever seen
on the ST! The author, Geoff Crammond, used to write some of the most amazing
games for the BBC Micro (Aviator - Best BBC flight sim ever, Revs - Best
driving game, Sentinel - Strange 3D power struggle). I have no connection
with Geoff other than the fact that his brother used to work here. But that's
not why I recommend Stunt Car Racer.
 
A game you should definately NOT buy is Hard Drivin'. It's a piece of *&%$!
Only the graphics are the same as the original. It's slow, buggy and a
complete insult to the capabilities of the ST. I guess that's why Domark were
only showing on TT's at the recent computer shows. You get a big stoopid
plastic box with a disk, a badge and a sticker in it.
 
Anyone played VET yet?
 
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
! DISCLAIMER: Unless otherwise stated, the above comments are entirely my own !
!                                                                             !
! "I think all right thinking people in this country are sick and tired of    !
! being told that ordinary decent people are fed up in this country with      !
! being sick and tired. I'm certainly not and I'm sick and tired of being     !
! told that I am!" - Monty Python                                             !
!                                                                             !
! Neil Forsyth                       JANET:  neil@uk.ac.hw.cs                 !
! Dept. of Computer Science          ARPA:   neil@cs.hw.ac.uk                 !
! Heriot-Watt University             UUCP:   ..!ukc!cs.hw.ac.uk!neil          !
! Edinburgh, Scotland, UK                                                     !
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 4 Dec 89 20:49:43 GMT
From: uvm-gen!pegram@uunet.uu.net  (pegram r)
Subject: Trash, Disks, etc.
Message-ID: <1353@uvm-gen.UUCP>
 
From article <9911@saturn.ucsc.edu>, by dstr012@ucscg.UCSC.EDU (10003012):
> Does anyone out there have or know where I can get a program to change
> the Trash and file cabinet icons on the desktop?  The old desktop is getting
> pretty boring and I am due for a change.  Thanks.
>
>          Roman Baker
 
1) Buy Neodesk, you get all sorts of icons, lose ?$40 and at least 21K ram.
   However, is much the best idea.
 
2) Just want to change the icons mentioned?  Buy an old START magazine disk
   off of Antic for ?$11 (you'll have to figure out which issue, my copies
   are at home).  Antic will also photocopy the article for you, if you
   ask (you might have to pay for that also).  The program is Alex Leavon's
   Icon Editor.  It comes with replacement icons (ugh!), which can be
   loaded on boot up.  Some nicer ones were available on Genie.  I could
   send the better ones to you (little 3.5 disks, etc.) but it is an editor
   - go to it.
 
        Bob Pegram (pegram@griffin.uvm-gen.uvm.edu  - that's U. of Vt.)
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 4 Dec 89 14:21:00 GMT
From: inmet!hedger@uunet.uu.net
Subject: What Kermit/UNITERM bugs?
Message-ID: <30200027@inmet>
 
I have used 2.0d for the past 2 weeks and have had no trouble transferring
files between my ST and our SUN system running 4.2 UNIX.
 
------------------------------
 
End of INFO-ATARI16 Digest V89 Issue #753
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