INFO-ATARI16 Digest         Mon, 20 Nov 89       Volume 89 : Issue 678
 
Today's Topics:
                   68030 processor upgrade project
           Anti-Atari Bashing Flame (long - sorry) (2 msgs)
          Gadgets by Small - Possible new '030 add-on board!
                  Problems booting w/accessories...
                  spectrum and quantumpaint formats
                         STe TOS BUG (2 msgs)
                            Vapourware!!!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Date: 19 Nov 89 18:22:20 GMT
From: mcsun!unido!tub!tmpmbx!netmbx!hase@uunet.uu.net  (Hartmut Semken)
Subject: 68030 processor upgrade project
 
>In article <3424@uafcveg.uucp>, cjy@uafhcx.uucp (Calvin Yockey) writes:
>>
>> P.S.  I am VERY excited at the prospect of David Small providing a low cost
>>      upgrade path to the 68030 and TI Graphics chip!  Go to it, Dave!
 
As far as I recall, Dave wrote, he'd like the TI graphic chips.
He did not mention including it in the 030 upgrade.
 
He also wrote, he would not support the 256k-ROMs till they are wildly
availeble.
 
 
I'm very interested in this board; hope, You'll get it running.
Spectre speedup would be fine; TOS speedup even better...
 
Dave, would You like to get some information about the related german
project PAK68 ans PAK-TOS?
 
hase
--
Hartmut Semken, Lupsteiner Weg 67, 1000 Berlin 37 hase@netmbx.UUCP
Dennis had stepped up into the top seat whet its founder had died of a
lethal overdose of brick wall, taken while under the influence of a
Ferrari and a bottle of tequila. (Douglas Adams; the long dark teatime...)
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 19 Nov 89 22:54:56 GMT
From: philmtl!atha!rwa@uunet.uu.net  (Ross Alexander)
Subject: Anti-Atari Bashing Flame (long - sorry)
 
steveg@SAIC.COM (Stephen Harold Goldstein) writes:
>Seems to me the people bitching at Atari have no one to blame but
>themselves for not making a more careful decision before buying.  If
>the TT isn't what you want, DON'T BUY ONE!
 
Good idea.  I think I'll buy a PS/2 - then I can keep my software
investment intact, right ?  Or less tersely, many of us feel Atari is
holding us hostage because although we could afford (easily) to go to
another vendor for a hardware platform, we're trapped by our current
software and data.  I for one have easily $2,500 tied up in packages
which work well, and with which I am happy, except that the hardware
platform has been completely outstripped.  I can't put a value on the
data I have lying around at all - ghods know how many hours I have
tied up in that.
 
So I'm pretty well committed to going with Atari again.
Unfortunately, Atari appears to think that this gives them the
opportunity to ignore me, and to slant their market offerings to
buyers at the low end, without losing the sale, and with no loss to
themselves.  I don't like that very much - I feel I'm simply being
taken for granted.  Anyone else out there feel like a captive too ?
If I'd gone with Big Blue (ugh) I could get a real powerhouse clone
now from any number of vendors and keep my software.  This would be
nice.
 
As for Greg Lindahl, yourself, and the rest of the cheerleaders:
what's _your_ investment in ST-line equipment?  In software?  In data
that only makes sense in relation to the afore-mentioned software?  In
hours spent learning the twisties of programming in the AES/VDI/GDOS
environment?  I'm on the hook for quite a few $$$'s, and many, many
hours.  I've got a 1040, 85 meg drive, two monitors, jato board,
memory upgrade, tons of other stuff, magic sack, I can't even keep
track of it all.  Have you noticed that many people expressing
unhappiness w/Atari have similar large investments?  I do not consider
myself a casual complainer.  Hell, I'm even a registered developer!
 
I want to buy a real high-end cpu/video section.  I don't see it yet;
the tt/p comes close but lacks expansion.  The tt/x may be it, but
it's a little too far away to bank on.  I see _lots_ of high end stuff
from other vendors that I can't buy because I've already spent my
money.  Where's my upgrade path, d*mnit?
 
        Ross
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 20 Nov 89 05:56:50 GMT
From:
 gem.mps.ohio-state.edu!samsung!aplcen!haven!uvaarpa!hudson!astsun.astro.Virgini
 a.EDU!gl8f@tut.cis.ohio-state.edu  (Greg Lindahl)
Subject: Anti-Atari Bashing Flame (long - sorry)
 
In article <1253@atha.AthabascaU.CA> rwa@cs.AthabascaU.CA (Ross Alexander)
 writes:
 
[ describes how Atari had what he wanted a while ago, but that it hasn't
  kept up with what other companies have been doing... ]
 
Well, this is a problem everywhere. Talk to all the science types who
bought VAXes in 1980 only to have to convert to Unix because DEC wouldn't
sell them fast boxes. And then DEC starts making fast VMS boxes again.
 
>So I'm pretty well committed to going with Atari again.
>Unfortunately, Atari appears to think that this gives them the
>opportunity to ignore me, and to slant their market offerings to
>buyers at the low end, without losing the sale, and with no loss to
>themselves.
 
Er, the TT isn't really much of a "low end machine" in any configuration.
You can't sell millions of home computers if they cost over $2,000. So you
have a curious definition of "low end".
 
>As for Greg Lindahl, yourself, and the rest of the cheerleaders:
>what's _your_ investment in ST-line equipment?  In software?
 
Well, first off, I'm hardly a cheerleader. I've NEVER said that I think
the ST is a price/performance winner. And I've never said I thought
Atari's marketing policy was good. I've only been playing devil's
advocate and pointing out obvious flaws, hoping that the flame war
will end.
 
And, yes, I have a big investment: about 1/3 of my total material
possessions is my ST. However, most of the software I use (terminal
emulation, LaTeX, Maple, Fortran) is portable elsewhere. I've spent
some time understanding GEM programming, but that is useful when I
program on other windowing systems. I got what I paid for in the first
place.
 
>I want to buy a real high-end cpu/video section.  I don't see it yet;
>the tt/p comes close but lacks expansion.
 
Wait until you see one. Then you'll know enough to make this statement.
 
 
------
Greg Lindahl
gl8f@virginia.edu                                  Astrophysicists for Choice.
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 19 Nov 89 17:45:26 GMT
From: mcsun!unido!tub!tmpmbx!netmbx!hase@uunet.uu.net  (Hartmut Semken)
Subject: Gadgets by Small - Possible new '030 add-on board!
 
In article <3322@jhunix.HCF.JHU.EDU> ins_bac@jhunix.UUCP (Ajay Choudhri) writes:
>In article <1989Nov16.180311.23182@gpu.utcs.utoronto.ca> nemeth@gpu.utcs.UUCP
 (Gabe Nemeth) writes:
>[PAK68 68000-proc replacement with 020/881 availeble now]
>Available now...well could you post more info for us non-europeans.
>I'd be interested in seeing some specifics on this..
>compatibility, speed increase, etc
 
So, here t goes:
 
The PAK68 is an c't project. c't is a german computer magazine.
 
Instuctions to build it were published some time ago, together with full
circurit description.
 
compatibility: none. TOS doesn't run; a TOS version hacked to run is not
very compatible (why, why did Atari use line-F for anything but floating
point?)
 
speed increase: well, the 020 runs at 8 MHz. The circurit was not
designed specifically for the ST...
circurits like Turbo-16, CMI speed or the like were designed for the St,
so they can fall back to 8 MHz wherever necessary and run at higher
clocks when the async BUS is used.
The PAK68 has support for high speed SRAM on a daugterboard.
But nobody made this availeble to TOS; the custom chips (DMA and SHIFTER)
cannot acess it (their adress registers are inside the MCU, so they can
only acess the MCU-supported DRAM). And most programs do not like to run
in anything but the standard RAM...
 
overall the speed increase is compareble to any 16-MHz 68000 accelerator
for the ST.
 
With ther german RTOS (nothing to do with TOS!), the PAK helps a lot
more, cause RTOS can use the cache, the 020 specific instructions and
the 881.
 
I exspect the Gadgets board to help a lot with Spectre and do almost
nothing for TOS. The ST is a closed machine; a compatible, faster
redesign is pretty exspensive.
TOS not only does not support processors other than 68000, it fights
them :-(
 
hase
 
--
Hartmut Semken, Lupsteiner Weg 67, 1000 Berlin 37 hase@netmbx.UUCP
Dennis had stepped up into the top seat whet its founder had died of a
lethal overdose of brick wall, taken while under the influence of a
Ferrari and a bottle of tequila. (Douglas Adams; the long dark teatime...)
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 19 Nov 89 15:02:58 GMT
From: mcsun!ukc!dcl-cs!gdt!gdr!exspes@uunet.uu.net  (P E Smee)
Subject: Problems booting w/accessories...
 
In article <1669@fredonia.UUCP> sale5312@fredonia.UUCP (Marty Saletta) writes:
>
>   I've got many disks with accessories, AUTO programs, etc.  Sometimes
>when I boot up with such a floppy (I'd guess about 10% of the time) I
>get the computer loading a few of the accessories, but then doing a
>cold or warm boot in the middle.  It's like someone hitting the reset
>switch during bootup before the GEM Desktop appears.
 
I went through a phase of that sort of problem, and it turned out to be
being caused by nothing more than a couple of bad sectors on the disk.
The sectors were only marginally bad (misaligned or weak, maybe?) so
they didn't always bite.  You might try looking at that possibility with
a disk-checking program.
 
A boot disk gets a lot of head travel, and since boot disks tend to be
fairly static and always accessed in the same pattern, it is easy to
believe that you might get one sort or another of physical wear to account
for this.
 
In any case, I solved my problem by the simple expedient of remaking (on
new disks) all of my boot disks which showed suspicious sectors; and I have
avoided the problem since by making it a practice to run a disk-checker on
my more commonly used boot disks once every couple of months.  Worth a try.
Sure, your problem might be more complicated, but it's easier to check for
the simple possibilities first...
 
--
 Paul Smee               |    JANET: Smee@uk.ac.bristol
 Computer Centre         |   BITNET: Smee%uk.ac.bristol@ukacrl.bitnet
 University of Bristol   | Internet: Smee%uk.ac.bristol@nsfnet-relay.ac.uk
 (Phone: +44 272 303132) |     UUCP: ...!uunet!ukc!gdr.bath.ac.uk!exspes
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 20 Nov 89 04:14:39 GMT
From:
 gem.mps.ohio-state.edu!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!xanth!xanth.cs.odu.edu!scott@tut
 .cis.ohio-state.edu  (Scott Yelich)
Subject: spectrum and quantumpaint formats
 
   Some more quick questions - Does anyone have information as to how spectrum
   and quantum paint programs are able to make the ST display more colours than
   usual?  I'm especially bewildered as to how quantum paint can display
   3375 colours or more!  Any info appreciated...
 
My quantum paint is pretty useless...
I have not seen a conversion program from quantum's own format over to any
other (gif would be best!) and so the images are neat to look at...
on my atari... in quantum paint.... but besides that, they are useless.
 
Also, my quantum paint screws up the colors whenever I get more than 30-40
of them on the screen at once!
(it does that nasty recalibration and changes the colors from like green
to red!)  I have not used my version since that happens to me EVERY time.
 
Scott
--
 
 -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Scott D. Yelich                                 scott@cs.odu.edu [128.82.8.1]
 After he pushed me off the cliff, he asked me, as I fell, ``Why'd you jump?''
 -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 19 Nov 89 23:57:19 GMT
From: mcsun!sunic!kullmar!pkmab!daniel@uunet.uu.net  (Daniel Deimert)
Subject: STe TOS BUG
 
Just a short PS.
I have found out what freqs they're using. Quite odd ones, really.
They are
                6258 Hz
                12517 Hz
                25033 Hz
                50066 Hz
 
With other words some kind of crystal divided with 1, 2, 4 or 8. Right?
 
Someone who knows how I can generate an interuppt with this freqs
for my sample-routine? Or will there be a new version of ST Replay and
similar packages?  Is patching possible? (Of course it is?!)
What about upgrades?
 
Think it's time to disassemble NEOWALL now.
 
--
    Daniel Deimert, Fridstav. 4, S-715 94 Odensbacken, SWEDEN
    Internet:   daniel@pkmab.se
    UUCP:       ...?uunet,mcvax?!sunic.sunet.se!kullmar!pkmab!daniel
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 19 Nov 89 13:56:55 GMT
From: mcsun!sunic!kullmar!pkmab!daniel@uunet.uu.net  (Daniel Deimert)
Subject: STe TOS BUG
 
Maybe we should make a list of bugs in the new STe's TOS?
I don't know if it has the same bugs as the normal ST's TOS 1.4,
but sure it has bugs!
 
The most obvious one is that it's impossible to record the
resolution desired in DESKTOP.INF;  whatever you save you will always
end up with low rez.
 
A quick fix for this is to save the desktop on a normal ST. Otherwise
you can get any texteditor and change the #D-entry (I think...) to 13
instead of 12.
 
I get some funny errors in the screen sometimes, when pulling up and
down the menus.  Looks a bit like an old version of QuickST, the desktop doesn't
redraw correct.  THis happends both in DevPac 2, UniTerm and the desktop.
 
BTW, the soundchip base seems to be $FF8900 -- maybe could someone from Atari
be kind enough to post a list of equates for the different adresses,
and the freqs used?  I can play a sample right now; but I can't sample
with the right speed! (I'd love to have the MFP setup!)
 
--
    Daniel Deimert, Fridstav. 4, S-715 94 Odensbacken, SWEDEN
    Internet:   daniel@pkmab.se
    UUCP:       ...?uunet,mcvax?!sunic.sunet.se!kullmar!pkmab!daniel
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 17 Nov 89 01:56:10 GMT
From: snorkelwacker!spdcc!merk!xylogics!cloud9!jjmhome!m2c!wpi!jdutka@CS.BU.EDU
 (John Dutka)
Subject: Vapourware!!!
 
1000x7000 PIXELS?  You sure about that?
 
 
+--------------------------+-------------------------------------------------+
| John A. Dutka  (jdutka)  | You've heard of the SI system of units, and the |
| WPI                      | British system of units.  Well, now, we've got  |
| 100 Institute Road       | the WPI System of Units (WSU).  More later.     |
| Box 2308                 +-------------------------------------------------+
| Worcester, MA 01609-2280 |      BITNET: jdutka@wpi.bitnet                  |
| United States of America |    INTERNET: jdutka@wpi.wpi.edu                 |
| (508) 755-7128           |      USENET: husc6!m2c!wpi!jdutka               |
+--------------------------+-------------------------------------------------+
 
------------------------------
 
End of INFO-ATARI16 Digest V89 Issue #678
*****************************************
