=========================================================================
 
INFO-ATARI16 Digest         Wed, 20 Dec 89       Volume 89 : Issue  839
 
Today's Topics:
                     Blitz copy cable and utility
                    Chaos Strikes Back (CSB) bugs?
             Comparing Apple and Atari peripheral prices
                         question SPECTRE GCR
                          Unexpandable megas
                            Usenet-->GEnie
               Usenet -> GEnie Link Considered Harmful
             USENET -> GEnie uplink now working (3 msgs)
                 Where did the binaries go? (2 msgs)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Date: 20 Dec 89 14:32:13 GMT
From:
 zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!usc!henry.jpl.nasa.gov!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!peregrine!c
 cicpg!paulm@tut.cis.ohio-state.edu  (tmp Paul Moreau usenet acct)
Subject: Blitz copy cable and utility
Message-ID: <51872@ccicpg.UUCP>
 
In article <SCOTT.89Dec19103442@offa.cs.odu.edu>, scott@cs.odu.edu (Scott
 Yelich) writes:
[ ... ]
> >  They are available on both the GEnie and CIS networks, and probably
> >  interminable BBS's. They're a bit long to uuencode and post here, though.
>
> ftp xanth.cs.odu.edu
>
> >  So, if you know someone on GEnie or CIS ...
>
> or if you have ftp access...
>
> REMEMBER:  ZIP files are self extracting archives....  :)
> --
[ .... ]
 
    If it is legal, could someone PLEASE post the Blitz software in the
    binaries group or somewhere?   I don't have access to GEnie nor do
    I know anyone who does.   I also can't ftp from here.
    I've built the cables and am now just awaiting code.
 
    Many many many thanx in advance!
---
   .===========================================================.
   |  ### ####### ###     |    N O R T H    | /==============\ |
   |  ### ###     ###     |  A M E R I C A  |< An STC Company >|
   |  ### ####### ####### |    (was CCI)    | \==============/ |
   |-----------------------------------------------------------|
   |  UUCP:  ...ccicpg!dl2!paulm   |      Paul L. Moreau       |
   |    or   ...ccicpg!dl1!paulm   | Diagnostics Software Eng. |
   |    or   ...ccicpg!paulm       |    Irvine, California     |
   `==========================================================='
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 20 Dec 89 23:49:41 GMT
From: well!dhawk@apple.com  (David Hawkins)
Subject: Chaos Strikes Back (CSB) bugs?
Message-ID: <15133@well.UUCP>
 
paul@cacilj.UUCP (Paul Close) writes:
 
 
>These are bugs, all right.  As one of the playtesters, I can tell you that FTL
>is very careful and particular about *any* odd behaviour, let alone blatant
>bugs like these.  You should report this to them.  Make sure and mention your
>machine type, TOS release, and and hardware mods.  I've never seen either of
>these....
 
I'm so lost that I don't know where this is, but there's a place
before the room with the ax and four knights.  Out in the hallway
right before that are two small wizards and three red cross buttons
(which I never did figure out in DM, by the way).  I killed a knight
out there and when I threw its armor down the hall way the screen
showed the piece of armor PLUS a sword each time.  BUG.
I've got an Atari 1040 ST with a DeskCart cartridge with the orignal
TOS release.  Nothing else fancy about it.
 
>This is a great game!  As a playtester, I've logged close to a hundred hours
>so far, and have only completed 1/4 of the game!  Good luck in the maze (heh,
>heh :-).  I've been all the way through the KU path, and part way through the
>others, so if anyone needs some help (that the oracle doesn't help with), feel
>free to ask.
 
Where do I get water?  I'm fighting a dragon and my team's about to
die for lack of water.  (I knocked off two worms down there.)
 
later, david
David Hawkins - dhawk@well.sf.ca.us - ?apple,pacbell,hplabs,ucbvax?!well!dhawk
There are two insults no human being will endure: that he has no sense of
humor, and that he has never known trouble.  -- Sinclair Lewis, "Main Street"
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Wed, 20 Dec 89 18:39:07 EST
From: mb <MBERNAR%ERENJ.BITNET@CORNELLC.cit.cornell.edu>
Subject: Comparing Apple and Atari peripheral prices
 
In a discussion on unexpandable mega ST's, kclenden@silver.bacs.indiana.edu
Kevin Clendenien states that Apple computers (he
also mentioned another brand) need Apple peripherals and that they cost much
more than Atari ST peripherals.  I don't know if you've looked at the Apple
side of things lately, but this just isn't true.
 
First of all, Apple computers (specifically Mac's) don't need to use Apple
peripherals.  Maybe you're not aware that there are more third party peripheral
suppliers for Macs than for ST.  Just look in any Mac specific magazine
and you'll be surprised to find how many brands of hard disks (internal and
external), back-up tape drives, graphics display cards and monitors and
floppy drives are available for the Mac.   There are also alternatives to
Apple Laserwriter and Imagewriter.
 
Second point.  Apple peripherals from third party suppliers are priced
at least the same as Atari ST peripherals.  In some cases, they are even
cheaper on the Mac than on the ST.  For example, look at hard drive prices.
Quantum has an ad for a 20 Meg hard disk for $499 (Atari Explorer).  You could
buy a larger drive for the Mac for the same price (Cutting Edge: 20 Meg - $439.
30 Meg - $499).  External floppy drive for the ST costs $149 (this is the
cheapest I've seen).  An equivalent Mac floppy drive costs the same.  Of course
memory is also cheaper on the Mac.
 
It seems to me that the only thing cheaper on the Atari ST is the computer
itself. I have a bare 1040STF at home and a new Mac IIci with loads of stuff
at work.
 
Regards,
Marcelino Bernardo
mbernar@erenj.bitnet
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 20 Dec 89 11:57:22 GMT
From: eru!luth!sunic!mcsun!ukc!stc!root44!hrc63!mrcu!ya16@bloom-beacon.mit.edu
 (Ian Powell)
Subject: question SPECTRE GCR
Message-ID: <317@mrcu>
 
In article <260934@neabbs.UUCP>, marclaan@neabbs.UUCP (MARC LAAN) writes:
> To: David Small (GBS)
> From: Marc H. Laan, newspaper Het Parool, Amsterdam, Holland.
>
> Dave,
> We tried to contact you by fax several times. Seems?to be no succes.
> we just had a simple question: since we laid hand on one of the
> (pre-)production models of Stacy, we'd like to test it as a portable
> Mac, with GCR. Until now we didn't hear of GCR overhere in Europe.
> Give us some clue please. (with ourpectre 1.9 Stacy performs allright,
> but probably you tested that too).
>  Friendly greetings, Marc H. Laan, Amsterdam-Diemen, Hollan
 
 
HiSoft have received a batch of Spectre GCRs here in the UK.
I don't know if they are all spoken for in advanced orders, a
phone call may worth wile.
 
 
HiSoft can be contacted at
The Old School
Greenfield
Bedford
MK45 5DE
UK
 
Tel. +44 5 2571 8181
 
PS I have upgraded my 128 to a GCR and it works well.
 
Ian Powell, CAL            |INTERNET: ya16%gec-mrc.co.uk@nsfnet-relay.ac.uk
GEC-Marconi Research Centre|UUCP: ...!mcvax!ukc!mrca!ya16 or ya16%uucp.mrca
West Hanningfield Road     |Other: ya16@uk.co.gec-mrc
Great Baddow, Chelmsford   |Tel: +44 245 73331 x 3231
Essex, UK CM2 8HN          |Telcom Gold 74: SKK196
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 20 Dec 89 21:59:39 GMT
From:
 haven!uvaarpa!murdoch.acc.virginia.edu!bessel.acc.Virginia.EDU!gl8f@ames.arc.na
 sa.gov  (Greg Lindahl)
Subject: Unexpandable megas
Message-ID: <1989Dec20.215939.22040@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU>
 
In article <370007@acf5.NYU.EDU> mitsolid@acf5.NYU.EDU (Thanasis Mitsolides)
 writes:
>> [ me ]
>>Maybe it doesn't cost them more? Do you know anything about manufacturing?
>
>I believe that you are right Greg.
>Probably it will not cost them more...  Eventually!
>
>Since Mega2s can not be expanded, more people would be *forced* to pay
>the unreasonably more expensive Mega4s. (now, 1Mbyte costs $90)
 
You are obviously wrong on 2 counts:
 
1) Then Atari would have not put SIMMs onto the STE
2) Then Atari would have not taken a $40 million charge against
   earnings for losses because they paid too much for components
   in those same Mega2's and 4's.
 
I think you'll find that soon Mega2's will disappear and Mega4's will
drop in price, reflecting lower component prices. Atari has inventory, and
when component prices drop they get left behind if they aren't careful.
 
Leave your silly conspiracy theories at home.
 
>Thus, they can afford the extra cost of manufacturing and keeping
>double inventory.
 
Oh, so YOU claim enough knowledge of manufacturing to know that
Atari is spending more money. Gosh. I never knew you were an expert.
 
------
Greg Lindahl
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 20 Dec 89 20:47:55 GMT
From:
 zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!xanth!cs.odu.edu!src@tut.cis.
 ohio-state.edu  (Scott R. Chilcote)
Subject: Usenet-->GEnie
Message-ID: <10785@xanth.cs.odu.edu>
 
In article <12486@cbnews.ATT.COM> nrc@cbnews.ATT.COM (neal.r.caldwell..ii)
 writes:
>From article <CMM.0.88.630161342.cmm1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu>, by
 cmm1@CUNIXA.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU (Christopher M Mauritz):
>> While I think this is a good idea, I am somewhat annoyed that this
>> arrangement only helps GEnie (a profiteering company) and does naught
>> for the users of this net.
>> ...
>> Chris Mauritz
 
>I agree whole heartedly!  This arrangement puts money into GEnie and
>does the net absolutely no good.
>for the Atari community but please put a stop to this before it goes any
>further.
>
>"Don't drive too slowly."                 Richard Caldwell
 
   There is a solution to this, but GEnie must be willing to reciprocate
fairly for their gain if they intend to plunder Usenet for their own advan-
tage.
 
   I am not against allowing more general access to comp.sys.atari.st if it
will help support the US Atari ST owning community.  But since GEnie is a
for-profit service --
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|   To be fair, they should return the benefit by posting summaries of their |
|postings, and cullings from their PD uploads, to Usenet in return.          |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
It is time for two new Newsgroups:  comp.genie.atari.st.talk and
                                    comp.genie.atari.st.bin .  These should
both be newsgroups moderated by GEnie staffers.
 
Sounds FAIR to me!
______________________________________________________________________________
                                                   Scott Chilcote
                                                   src@cs.odu.edu
 
ST stands for "Sidestepped Tramiel"!
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Wed, 20 Dec 89 18:30:49 -0500
From: David M. Baggett <dmb@TIS.COM>
Subject: Usenet -> GEnie Link Considered Harmful
Message-ID: <8912202330.AA02448@TIS.COM>
 
I've never felt compelled to write a netnote about anything political
before, but the proposal to establish a one-way link from Usenet to
GEnie really bothers me.
 
I agree with Diane Close that this is a bad thing, for many of the reasons
she gave.  (See her early posting "The Rape of Usenet", 20 Dec 89)
The one-way nature of the link absolutely goes against the "freedom of
information exchange" which Dave Small is seeking.
 
It is unfortunate that GEnie's policies make it look like we Usenet folks
are "hogging information", but unless a two-way link is established Dave
Small will essentially be SELLING the FREE information provided here ---
there is no exchange whatsoever (Usenet gets nothing).
 
Let me point out that I believe Dave Small had noble intentions in proposing
this.  I am NOT accusing Dave Small of any ill intent.  On the contrary,
I believe he thought he would be providing a service for the ST community.
I just think his proposal for a one-way Usenet->GEnie link would start a
trend that could damage the Usenet permanently.
 
My humble opinion:
 
A two-way link or none at all.
 
 
David Baggett
(mail to dmb@TIS.COM)
 
----------------
My opinions on this matter do not in any way represent the opinions of
my employer.
 
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 21 Dec 89 00:23:50 GMT
From: rochester!kodak!elmgate!jdg@rutgers.edu  (Jeff Gortatowsky CUST)
Subject: USENET -> GEnie uplink now working
Message-ID: <1177@elmgate.UUCP>
 
   I agree entirely with Diane? on this one. Genie is commercial, and wants
money from me to use it. If I wish to give them information, I will join
GEnie. A fair? solution is the downlink of their respective items, which
I'm sure they'd protest to. As, why call Genie (I ask myself that many times
in the past, since, Usenet seems to have a much more knowledgable
and reasonable clientel) if one can get the info at no cost to the individual.
fair is fair... If GEnites want to read my postings, I certainly would
appreciate the opposite. So I vote "NO" to uplink only. And, as previously
stated the Usenet administration should at very least "know" about it.
 
--
Jeff Gortatowsky-Eastman Kodak Company  .....rochester!kodak!elmgate!jdg
(use uuhosts or such to find path to rochester)
Eastman Kodak makes film not comments.  Therefore these comments are mine
not theirs.
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 20 Dec 89 19:24:14 GMT
From: hp-pcd!hplsla!andyc@hplabs.hp.com  (Andy Cassino)
Subject: USENET -> GEnie uplink now working
Message-ID: <5440092@hplsla.HP.COM>
 
With reference to David Small's announcement:
 
| It's time to announce that there is now a working uplink
| from USENET to GEnie. Each note posted into comp.sys.atari.st is sorted
| by topic, and uploaded to "Category 10" of the Gadgets RT on GEnie.
 
I am in complete agreement with Dianne Barlow Close on this matter. USENET
is not for profit, and I object to GEnie profiting from people reading USENET
postings on GEnie.
 
Since I cannot post the stuff I download from GEnie to Usenet, I fail to see
why GEnie should be entitled to charge people to read Usenet articles.
 
Disclaimer: The opinions expressed herein are those solely of the author,
            who has no pecuniary interest in the companies, products,
            or publications mentioned above.
 
Copyright (c) 1989 by Andrew Cassino.
Permission for distribution on USENET hereby granted.
Distribution to GEnie expressly forbidden.
 
    %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
    % Andy Cassino                                                  %
    % uucp: hplabs!hplsla!andyc  domain: andyc%hplsla@hplabs.hp.com %
    % Hewlett-Packard              Lake Stevens Instrument Division %
    % 8600 Soper Hill Road                   Everett, WA 98205-1298 %
    % (206) 335-2211                                                %
    %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 21 Dec 89 00:23:03 GMT
From: mcsun!cernvax!chx400!ethz!chris@uunet.uu.net  (Christian Dreyer)
Subject: USENET -> GEnie uplink now working
Message-ID: <2907@ethz.UUCP>
 
In article <935@crash.cts.com> canada@crash.cts.com (Diane Barlow Close) writes:
>In article <15097@well.UUCP> dsmall@well.UUCP (David Small) writes (now
>much edited):
>
>What I object to the most is the fact that the link is one way (and will
>stay that way due to GEnie's commercial nature).  I don't like Usenet being
>``raped'' to supply GEnie's commercial pockets.  If GEnie is that ``tapped
>out'' for knowledge that they are desperate enough to plunder Usenet, then
>perhaps GEnie should be disbanded.
 
That's kinda my VHO as well. One-way transfer is hardly ever fair and
I think it won't support the Atari-community either (that should be the
point, shouldn't it).
 
--
   $      Chris  Dreyer      St. Gall Graduate School for Economic and    $
   $      Student            Social Science, Switzerland                  $
   $      DREYER@CSGHSG5A.BITNET      !cernvax!ethz!chris (UUCP)          $
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 20 Dec 89 23:25:24 GMT
From: eru!luth!sunic!mcsun!tuvie!roland@bloom-beacon.mit.edu
 (Inst.f.Allg.Elektrotechnik)
Subject: Where did the binaries go?
Message-ID: <1004@tuvie>
 
In article <5277.258f8ee3@jane.uh.edu> richard@jane.uh.edu writes:
>Whappened to Comp.sys.atari.st? The last binary that I have received was
>dated Oct. 4 1989. Is any one else having this problem or are the files
>just not geeting through to this sight.
>                                         Richard L. Coggins
>                                    University of Houston Computing Center
 
tuvie is the Austrian backbone.
The last binaries received here date from December 4th.
But only the first five parts of the nine part Modula-2 Algebra System
made it to tuvie. The rest is still missing.
After that part8 of form was received witch was also missing in the first
posting of form.
 
Merry Christmas to everyone, and hopefully Santa can fix it...  :-)
 
Roland Schreier         _                     Technical University of Vienna
Gusshausstrasse 27-29  |_)  _  |  _   _   _|  +43 (222) 58801 3838
A-1040 Wien            | \ (_) | (_| | | (_|  SCHREIER@EAECL1.UNA.AT
Oesterreich - Europe                          roland@tuvie.at
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 21 Dec 89 00:50:50 GMT
From:
 cs.utexas.edu!sun-barr!newstop!texsun!pollux!ti-csl!vlsic2!parker@tut.cis.ohio-
 state.edu  (James Parker)
Subject: Where did the binaries go?
Message-ID: <103311@ti-csl.csc.ti.com>
 
richard@jane.uh.edu writes:
 
>Whappened to Comp.sys.atari.st? The last binary that I have received was
>dated Oct. 4 1989. Is any one else having this problem or are the files
>just not geeting through to this sight.
 
I was just wondering myself. I haven't seen anything new in comp.binaries
OR comp.sources.atari.st for what seems like months now.
 
james parker
Texas Instruments, Dallas
 
------------------------------
 
End of INFO-ATARI16 Digest V89 Issue #839
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