Info-Atari16 Digest         Fri,  5 Apr 91       Volume 91 : Issue 193
 
Today's Topics:
       (INQUIRY) ST players for Amiga animation and *.SPS files
                   Aladin Mac emulator problems...
                     Analyze! Metafiles  (HELP!)
                     Atari cpu evolution (2 msgs)
               Does Lode Runner game exist for the ST?
          Flicker Palettes [was Re: Graphics on the STE...]
            Graphics on the STE - v. generally speaking...
                           hard disk cache
                       MEGA => MEGA STE Board?
                      MEGA STE trouble (2 msgs)
         Problems with ST Writer (3.8) double column format.
                    RUFUS problem - it won't run!
           Specre GCR MAC -> DeskJet Printer Driver Needed
                        Spectrum/3-D/animation
               Stalker/Steno & Diamond Back II w/Cache
                   The cause of the phantom typist
                             union demo 2
 
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Date: 5 Apr 91 02:03:51 GMT
From: wixer.UUCP!bgodot@ucbvax.berkeley.edu (Paul Ortega)
Subject: (INQUIRY) ST players for Amiga animation and *.SPS files
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
Is there an ST player for the Amiga animations that are played with
the Amiga program 'flick'?
 
Also, what kind of ST graphics files are those with the .SPS
extender?  I downloaded a number of them (NAGEL**.SPS) , but can't view
them.  What do I need to view those?
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 4 Apr 91 15:12:48 GMT
From:
 noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!usc!snorkelwacker.mit.edu!bloom-beacon!eru!hagbard
 !sunic!mcsun!ukc!pyrltd!lucifer!ralph@arizona.edu ( 244)
Subject: Aladin Mac emulator problems...
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
Are there any Aladin users out there ??
 
I have just inherited an Aladin Mac emulator, complete with original
disks and documentation.  Unfortunately, several of the PD utility
disks appear to be damaged in some way.
 
One of the disks has some games on, but when trying to mount it, Aladin
claims that it is not an Aladin disk.  I've looked through a Mac hints
book which claims that this is can probably be fixed by holding down
OPTION+'cloverleaf' keys during bootup.  Does you happen to know if
these keys are emulated, and if so, what they are mapped to ??
 
The other disk seems to start mounting properly, but it never finishes.
I see the disk access light go on, the mouse pointer changes to wristwatch
during several seconds of disk access.  It then flips back to the pointer
and back to the watch again and does a little more disk access.  After
some more seconds, the disk light goes out and nothing happens.  I've
tried leaving it for a long time to see if it's thinking about it, but
nothing ever happens.  The arrow pointer never comes back.  The only way
to get out of it seems to be a reboot...
 
What really bothers me is that these damaged disks appear to be the only
ones that contain binhex and MacKermit, so I can't download any other PD
stuff...
 
I have managed to get hold of a copy of binhex on a TOS disk, which I've
copied over to Aladin using the Gem file import program, but it comes
through in a non-executable form.  Do you happen to know of a way to
make it into an executable application ??  I am willing to start editing
disks to get this to work....
 
Of course, an Aladin disk containing some kind of terminal emulator/download
would be most welcome...
 
Thanks in Advance
 
Ralph Mitchell
--
Paper: Electronic Control Group, Lucas Powertrain Systems, Phoenix Way,
       Cirencester, Gloucestershire, GL7 1QG, United Kingdom.
Voice: +44 285 657981            Fax:   +44 285 658258
Bang:  ...!ukc!lucifer!ralph     Janet: ralph@uk.co.lucasauto.eg
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 5 Apr 91 03:26:14 GMT
From:
 noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!usc!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!uakari.primate.wisc.
 edu!unmvax!nmt.edu!eahsnsr@arizona.edu (Eric A. Hobbs)
Subject: Analyze! Metafiles  (HELP!)
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
Has anyone used the make Metafile option of the _Analyze!_ spreadsheet?
It doesn't seem to work right. The files it creates don't correctly load
into DP programs. Also, when I use GEM2PS, the program creates a series
of definitions and the like, but never makes any print information.
 
Could it be that it is creating IBM Metafiles? Or does the fact that it
must use GDOS automatically mean that it is trying to create GEM Metafiles?
 
----------------
Eric A. HOBBS!
eahsnsr@JUPITER.nmt.edu
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 5 Apr 91 05:53:16 GMT
From: fernwood!portal!cup.portal.com!Bob_BobR_Retelle@decwrl.dec.com
Subject: Atari cpu evolution
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
Lotsa speculation about Atari using '040 and beyond..
 
Golly.. Lenonard Tramiel has already stated that Atari will never use
the 68040 (I think it was at the Glendale AtariFest last year..?), so
why worry about it..?
 
Atari wouldn't lie to us, would they..?
 
BobR
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 5 Apr 91 00:15:38 GMT
From:
 noao!asuvax!ukma!psuvax1!uwm.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!rpi!news-server.csri
 .toronto.edu!torsqnt!geac!maccs!johns@arizona.edu (Conan the Barbarian)
Subject: Atari cpu evolution
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
Are people seriously replying to this message?  Wouldn't it be wise to
be at least a little skeptical?
 
>Article 32880 of comp.sys.atari.st:
>>From: kiki@uhunix1.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu
>Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
>Subject: Atari cpu evolution
>Keywords: Motorola 68040
>Message-ID: <12229@uhccux.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu>
>Date: 1 Apr 91 07:31:56 GMT
       ~~~~~
Does this date mean anything to anyone?
>Sender: news@uhccux.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu
>Organization: University of Hawaii
 
        Or maybe this is one of them there prolonged jokes, and the joke
is on me for not recognizing it as such.  <insert fav. smiley>
 
 
--
John Schmitt
johns@maccs.dcss.mcmaster.ca
!unet!utai!utgpu!maccs!johns
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 5 Apr 91 01:24:51 GMT
From:
 noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!sdd.hp.com!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!unmvax!nmt.edu!
 eahsnsr@arizona.edu (Eric A. Hobbs)
Subject: Does Lode Runner game exist for the ST?
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
In article <1991Apr3.205704.8441@unislc.uucp> bj@unislc.uucp (Bruce Jones)
 writes:
>The subject says it all.  I would like to get Lode Runner for the
>ST if it exists.  If yes, does someone want to sell their copy?  If
>the answer is no are there any similar type games that you can recommend?
 
There is a good mono-only Lode Runner clone at atari.archive. It's
from Germany and I think it's name is GO_UP.
 
 
-------------
Eric A. HOBBS!
eahsnsr@JUPITER.nmt.edu
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 5 Apr 91 06:02:12 GMT
From:
 noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!sdd.hp.com!think.com!mintaka!ogicse!unmvax!nmt.edu
 !eahsnsr@arizona.edu (Eric A. Hobbs)
Subject: Flicker Palettes [was Re: Graphics on the STE...]
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
In article <1991Apr4.223506.11715@imada.dk> micro@imada.dk (Klaus Pedersen)
 writes:
 
  [stuff deleted]
 
>
>I have some code at here that can display 256 graylevels on the mono screen.
>(written in C). The program is less than 50 lines long, and features
>an advanced errordiffusion ditering algoritm, with a small edge sharping
>filter (simple laplace). This have been coupled with a 3 screen 'flicker'
>mode. The result is approx. the same as 256 grayscale VGA LCD screens (I
>think mine is better, because there is no shadows running around the screen,
>but...)
>The 3 screens is build to that the 'on' pixels is equally distributed on the
>3 'planes' - this avoids flicker.
>All this could used with color too, and I think the result would be even
>better because you can pick colors which is closer to each other (than on and
>off)...
>In color mode you can probaly show true-color, but you will need to make some
>additional code, to handle interesting subjets - such as picking reprensative
>colors from the picture file...
>
>The program IS  quick hack, and therefor it only runs on mono in 640x400.
>I will send the source to who-ever that is interested...
>
>Klaus (micro@imada.dk)
 
 
Wow! Now if only someone would write a mono GIF viewer with this!!!
<Hint> <Hint> <Hint>  :-)
I would if I knew how to program!!!
 
 
------------
Eric A. HOBBS!
eahsnsr@JUPITER.nmt.edu
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 5 Apr 91 06:09:54 GMT
From: fernwood!portal!cup.portal.com!Bob_BobR_Retelle@decwrl.dec.com
Subject: Graphics on the STE - v. generally speaking...
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
>It seemed reasonable to point out here that VGA uses a minimum of (I hope I
>have this right) 256 K of screen memory.  I'm rather nearer to certain that
>most super VGA uses a Meg.  This isn't the sort of thing that would have bee
>considered reasonable when the ST was designed.
 
That's very true..!
 
Of course, the ST was designed over *FIVE YEARS* ago, and has never really
changed since then..
 
                               ( WHY???)
 
 
An Atari 8-bit screen only took up 8k of RAM...   if you want to take it to
extremes, an AstroCade only needed 2K to display a full screen..
 
Why not change with the times..?  Why not provide competitive graphics
modes..?
 
 
Why...?
 
BobR
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Fri, 5 Apr 1991 12:35 N
From: HANTKE%KVI.NL@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU
Subject: hard disk cache
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
Hi folks,
 
Mathew (noao!asuvax!cs.utexas.edu!usc!snorkelwacker.mit.edu!bloom-beacon!eru!
hagbard!sunic!mcsun!ukc!slxsys!ibmpcug!mantis!mathew@arizona.edu (mathew))
writes:
 
> I'm looking for a hard disk cache program for my ST, to speed up things a
> little. I'm sure that there are hundreds of such things, so I wondered if
> anyone had any recommendations...
>
> (...)
 
Working under TOS 1.2 I have been using FATSPEED.PRG and DCACHE.TTP.
DCACHE.TTP gives you the options to
   - select drive(s) to be cached
   - write through/on/off individually for each drive
   - total cache memory
   - maximum cache block size
and some more. These features can also be controlled by an ACCessory, which you
can optionally install.
 
Bugs I came across using DCACHE are so far::
1. Write-through OFF and disk write-protected: Delete all files on disk #1.
   NO (!) write prot. is indicated and files are (virtually) deleted. Then do
   not flush and insert another disk (#2) which is unprotected.
   Flush, and disk #2 is deleted!
2. Write-through ON and disk protected: delete all files results in a
   strange error message (as far as I remember).
3. Accessory is informative, but not user-friendly.
 
Summary
   You can live with the 'bugs' as far as you use wrt-thr always (which I do)
   and use the -ttp with appropriate parameters for information instead of
   the accessory.
 
PLEASE,
   quote your address when asking questions in the digest. A kind of
   address as quoted above is not very useful for contacting people personally
   (what I tried).
 
Cheers,
 
Thomas
 
(hantke@kvi.nl)
---------------
Thomas Hantke, V. Oldenbarneveltlaan 16, NL-9716 EJ Groningen, The Netherlands
fax ++3150-634003, phone ++3150-633259,778777
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 5 Apr 91 05:05:03 GMT
From: noao!ncar!news.miami.edu!umiami!dlk0ms9s@arizona.edu
Subject: MEGA => MEGA STE Board?
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
   I have heard that Atari Canada has a bridgeboard for the MEGA computers to
turn them into a MEGA STE.  Now, like I said this is just stuff I have been
hearing and I was wondering if any of our Canadian frineds, or anyone else out
there has any info on this.  And if so, when, if ever, might we see it in the
US?  From what I heard it plugs into the expansion port behind the CPU.
 
  Mark Santora
  Film Production Major at the Univeristy of Miami
  Internet: dlk0ms9s@umaimi.ir.miami.edu
 
 If the world was ruled by women, would missles be shaped any differently?
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 5 Apr 91 01:36:27 GMT
From:
 noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!sdd.hp.com!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!unmvax!nmt.edu!
 eahsnsr@arizona.edu (Eric A. Hobbs)
Subject: MEGA STE trouble
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
In article <CMM.0.88.670807428.larserio@kvart.ifi.uio.no> larserio@ifi.uio.no
 writes:
>I have two problems with my new MEGA STE, and wondered if anyone out there
>hadany good ideas for fixing them:
>
>1)  When using STEREO DMA sound (not normal ST sound) I get "static" (small
>    clicks kind of) in the sound.  Sounds almost like a spark.  Occurs even
>    when there is no sound (as long as the voulume is on).  It has has no
>    strict pattern and occurs every now and then.   Anyone have an idea ??
 
I don't have an STE so I am assuming that you are playing samples.
If the sample is recorded so that when you look at it on a sample
editing program, the sample is not vertically centered over the "zero"
output line, you will almost invariably hear a "pop" at the beginning
and end of the sample. This is because the player is trying to jump
from zero output to a higher output. In which case, any computer
will pop while trying to make the sound.
Of course, this is all assuming that you in fact _are_ playing samples.
 
If any of this makes any sense to you, then good for you! :-)
 
-------------------
Eric A. HOBBS!
eahsnsr@JUPITER.nmt.edu
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 5 Apr 91 01:27:44 GMT
From:
 noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!jarthur!petunia!csuchico.edu!ekrimen@arizona.edu
 (Ed Krimen)
Subject: MEGA STE trouble
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
In article <CMM.0.88.670807428.larserio@kvart.ifi.uio.no> larserio@ifi.uio.no
 writes:
>I have two problems with my new MEGA STE, and wondered if anyone out there
>hadany good ideas for fixing them:
>
>1)  When using STEREO DMA sound (not normal ST sound) I get "static" (small
>    clicks kind of) in the sound.  Sounds almost like a spark.  Occurs even
>    when there is no sound (as long as the voulume is on).  It has has no
>    strict pattern and occurs every now and then.   Anyone have an idea ??
>
 
I get this on my STe as well.  Not as often as it seems you do, however.  Mine
occurs usually about once every two weeks or so.  Could it be non-computer
related, such as your amp or speakers?
 
 
--
         Ed Krimen  ...............................................
   |||   Video Production Major, California State University, Chico
   |||   INTERNET: ekrimen@ecst.csuchico.edu  FREENET: al661
  / | \  SysOp, Fuji BBS: 916-894-1261        FIDONET: 1:119/4.0
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 5 Apr 91 02:05:17 GMT
From: wixer.UUCP!bgodot@ucbvax.berkeley.edu (Paul Ortega)
Subject: Problems with ST Writer (3.8) double column format.
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
I've been having problems with the double-column formatting with
version 3.8 of ST Writer.
 
It truncates the line at column 105, no matter what I set the second
right margin to.
 
I'm using a Star NX-1000 and the EPSON MX-80 printer driver
(EPSMX80.DAT).  It could be the printer driver messing it up, but
seems the closest printer driver to the Star.
 
Is there a printer driver specificly for the Star NX-1000?
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 4 Apr 91 18:17:17 GMT
From: garfield!carlos@uunet.uu.net (MiG - Miguel Borges)
Subject: RUFUS problem - it won't run!
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
I ftp'ed RUFUS.TOS from the atari.archive.  I ran the self-extracting archive,
and then booted up the disk.  The GDOS-clone was in the auto folder, and
the fonts were in the GEMSYS folder, just like the archiver left them.
I ran RUFUS.PRG, but all I got was an alert box, saying something like
"GDOS falhure - Ungultiges Handle"  I assume it's german.  Anybody know
how to get this working?  Are there english docs available?
 
--
C. Miguel Borges     |"Cyberspace. A consensual hallucination...     |||
carlos@odie.cs.mun.ca|Unthinkable complexity. Lines of light ranged  |||
an630@po.cwru.edu    |in the nonspace of the mind, clusters and     / | \
ad040@yfn.ysu.edu    |constellations of data. Like city lights, receding..."
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Thu, 4 Apr 1991 22:09 PDT
From: MHD@PCR.SLAC.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Specre GCR MAC -> DeskJet Printer Driver Needed
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
John Kawakami @ocf.berkeley.edu requested information about using the
MacPrint printer driver with Spectre GCR.  Perhaps this may help.
 
I have my DeskJet 500 working just fine with Spectre GCR 3.0 and
MacPrint.  I did have some problems to begin with but found a solution
that worked.
 
The cable that comes with MacPrint is a Mac serial cable.  Just use
your own parallel cable and hook up your ST to the parallel port
of the DeskJet with it.
 
First, make sure that your DeskJet is turned on before turning on the
ST.  (There has been correspondance this past week about installing a
diode or pnp transistor to make this procedure unnecessary.)
 
Install MacPrint according to directions.  You may have problems when
using the CHOOSER to set the DeskJet as the printer driver.  If the
SETTINGS menu does not work and you cannot set the printer port, then
do the following:
 
1.  Look in the INSIGHT folder inside your system folder.  MacPrint
    has made a new file there 'DeskJet info' ( or 'DeskJet Plus info').
 
2.  Move this file outside of the INSIGHT folder so that it is just in
    the system folder but not inside any folder therein.
 
3. Try again.  The settings menu should work now.
 
When you have everything working get yourself Adobe Type Manager.  The
results are great on the DeskJet.
 
You can save lots of money by refilling your ink cartridges.  RayDar
Products, 270 Winston Rd., Andrews AFB, MD 20331 sells a kit to refill
DeskJet ink cartridges for $17.95 plus $2 for shipping and handling.
 
Martin Donald
 
   Bitnet               MHD@SLACPCR
   DECnet               PCR::MHD    (44.37 = 45093)
   Internet             MHD@PCR.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 5 Apr 91 09:09:07 GMT
From:
 noao!asuvax!ukma!usenet.ins.cwru.edu!agate!darkstar!bill!monsoon@arizona.edu
 (Monsoon)
Subject: Spectrum/3-D/animation
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
In article <1991Apr4.190424.13189@milton.u.washington.edu>
 alexd@milton.u.washington.edu (Alex Danilchik) writes:
>Can this be done:
>
>Create a 3-D model in Sculpt 3-D, paint/render it with
>Spectrum, then animate the frames?
>
>Is there any software pacakge/integration of packages,
>that can do this for me using Spectrum?  I do want the
>advantage of all those colors on the screen at once...
>
>Thanks
>
>gunnar
>alexd@milton.u.washington.edu
 
        There are several ways to do this.  First of all, to get animation
using Spectrum 512, there is a program called Unispec, which is actually an
upgrade module to Spectrum, which turns it into a desk accessory and adds
many new features (including animation.)  The new additions alone merit
recommendation for anyone who uses Spectrum, such as better anti-alised(sp)
functions, and an improved dithered blur, just to name a scad few.
 
        As for rendering it in spectrum, there is a painful way, and some
other not so painful ways...
 
        First of all, you could always just use Cad 3-D (I believe you are
referring to CyberSculpt, if not, then the rest of these techniques do not
apply...) and do a straight degas import into Spectrum, frame by frame (also,
Cyber Control, an animation scripting language, is recommended for this) and
tweak the colors using spectrums global color commands.
 
        There is also a program from the magazine STart, called RezRender.
This program can use Cad 3-D objects, and raytrace them using various styles
(flat polygons, gourad shading, off the top of my head), BUT can only render
in 16 shades (yes you can make 16 psuedo-shades, on most colors except some
such as grey).  It does, however have many excellent features like shadowing,
chekerboard plane backgrounds, gradient backgrounds, and limited animation.
I believe this can be founds in the February 1989 or 1990 issue of STart.
 
        Another program, called GFA Raytrace (which is VERY hard to find, but
one source would be on the British-mag ST Format, not sure which issue) which
will raytrace objects in full, glorious 512 colors, BUT it is not compatible
with Spectrum 512, and the tools are quite limited.
 
        Also, there is news of a new program from a company called Lexicorp,
which is creating a 3-D rendering system far superior to the Cyber series.
 
        In summary, it is a bit of a pain to do 3-D animation in Spectrum.
Like any system, you need gobs of memory (even at 8 Megs you run out of room!),
and things like an accelerator are VERY handy to have (it took me at least
12 hours to render 16 frames of a rotating object on a stock 1040 using
RezRender).
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 5 Apr 91 01:22:47 GMT
From:
 noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!jarthur!petunia!csuchico.edu!ekrimen@arizona.edu
 (Ed Krimen)
Subject: Stalker/Steno & Diamond Back II w/Cache
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
In article <1991Apr4.223352.19625@netcom.COM> yonder@netcom.COM (Christopher
 Russell) writes:
>I am looking for the latest versions of Diamond Back II with Cache (v2.2) and
>the new version of Stalker/Steno (with Zmodem, etc, v3.0 ?)  All of the
>mail order places I have called don't have these products in stock. Anybody
>know of a place that has these?  I know I could probably get these both
>direct, but the "Street" price on these products is much lower than the list.
 
The latest version of STalker is 2.06.  Version 3.0 won't be out for
a couple of months still; at least that's what Eric Rosenquist says.  I highly
recommend you get STalker now and upgrade later.
 
 
--
         Ed Krimen  ...............................................
   |||   Video Production Major, California State University, Chico
   |||   INTERNET: ekrimen@ecst.csuchico.edu  FREENET: al661
  / | \  SysOp, Fuji BBS: 916-894-1261        FIDONET: 1:119/4.0
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 4 Apr 91 21:13:42 GMT
From: fernwood!portal!atari!apratt@decwrl.dec.com (Allan Pratt)
Subject: The cause of the phantom typist
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
micro@imada.dk (Klaus Pedersen) writes:
>> To exorcise one may
>> 1) Replace expressions like ++i; if(i == ANYPOWEROFTWO) i= 0;
>>    by ++i &= (ANYPOWEROFTWO - 1)
 
>jan@janhh.hanse.de (Jan Willamowius) writes:
> in what language do you want to write that?
>What you are writing is :
>    ++i = ++i & (APO2-1);
> - no matter how you try to hide it...
 
That's not true. Semantically, "i += 2;" is equivalent to "i = i + 2;"
but "++i += 2;" is not equivalent to "++i = ++i + 2;" because the
people who designed C are smarter than that.  The side-effect is
performed only once.
 
But regardless of that, you are suggesting that what happens in a C
statement is uninterruptable, so doing something in a single statement
makes it safe when it might be unsafe in multiple statements.  This is
not true.  On the 68000 family, an interrupt can come between any two
instructions.  Individual instructions can't be interrupted, but the
bus can be arbitrated away (for DMA, for example) between the read and
the write of a read-modify-write instruction, except for the TAS
instruction which is explicitly atomic.
 
============================================
Opinions expressed above do not necessarily     -- Allan Pratt, Atari Corp.
reflect those of Atari Corp. or anyone else.      ...ames!atari!apratt
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 5 Apr 91 05:43:38 GMT
From: fernwood!portal!cup.portal.com!Bob_BobR_Retelle@decwrl.dec.com
Subject: union demo 2
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
Lotsa questions about various "demos" for the ST..
 
These demos are great, but..  is anyone involved in creating the demos
also involved in creating anything useful..?
 
If you bother to wait through all the text on most of these demos, they
all seem to be self-congratulatory messages between various software
pirating groups...
 
We've got a wonderful body of "demos" to run on our computers, but do they
equate into anything "real"..?
 
BobR
 
------------------------------
 
End of Info-Atari16 Digest
******************************