Info-Atari16 Digest         Sun,  7 Apr 91       Volume 91 : Issue 197
 
Today's Topics:
       (INQUIRY) ST players for Amiga animation and *.SPS files
                      .IMG/Pagestream/Postscript
                    Apple StyleWriter with the ST?
                           BMS tape backup
               Does Lode Runner game exist for the ST?
                    Epson LQ-510 printer for sale
                               lzh use
                                 oids
                              Pagestream
                          smail on Atari ST
                    SPC Pics from Umich, corrupt?
                        Spectrum/3-D/animation
                    Standardized GEM look and feel
                        union demo 2 (4 msgs)
                      Zmodem and Xmodem for VAX
 
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Date: 7 Apr 91 07:39:30 GMT
From:
 noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!swrinde!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!caen!uflorida!ma
 iler.cc.fsu.edu!nu!boyd@arizona.edu (Mickey Boyd)
Subject: (INQUIRY) ST players for Amiga animation and *.SPS files
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
In article <9104050203.AA02014@wixer>, bgodot@wixer.UUCP (Paul Ortega) writes:
>Also, what kind of ST graphics files are those with the .SPS
>extender?  I downloaded a number of them (NAGEL**.SPS) , but can't view
>them.  What do I need to view those?
 
I uploaded a viewer when I uploaded those Nagels (they are terrible, I have
a much better batch coming soon.  Should have checked first . . .).  The
viewer is in a file called, um, specshow.arc or showspec.arc (sheesh, it was
late).
 
--
    ---------------------------------+-------------------------------------
             Mickey R. Boyd          |  "Kirk to Enterprise.  All clear
          FSU Computer Science       |      down here.  Beam down
        Technical Support Group      |      yeoman Rand and a six-pack . ."
      email:  boyd@fsucs.cs.fsu.edu  |
    ---------------------------------+-------------------------------------
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 7 Apr 91 08:16:42 GMT
From:
 noao!asuvax!ukma!widener!iggy.GW.Vitalink.COM!lll-winken!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!swr
 inde!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!caen!uflorida!mailer.cc.fsu.edu!nu!boyd@arizona.
 edu (Mickey Boyd)
Subject: .IMG/Pagestream/Postscript
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
In article <1991Apr6.201033.3056@milton.u.washington.edu>,
 alexd@milton.u.washington.edu (Alex Danilchik) writes:
>Hi.
>
>My question:  Am I in for trouble in placing .IMG files into
>a Postscript format?  Should I expect loss or degradation in the
>conversion?  is there a conversion?  and, what .IMG editing tools
>are out there?  TOUCH_UP ? others?  Are .IMG typically large?
>And if converted to PS.. can I assume that were I to go to a
>printhouse for greater than 300dpi, i will be able to get the
>higher resolution for the graphics images?
>
 
No problem, I do it all the time.  I cannot detect any loss of resolution.
I do all my printing at school, and only use my little 9-pin to check
alignment (Pagestream allows one to lighten the density of a printout, so
I can check stuff fast).  I print PS to disk, then put it on a floppy and
lpr it on a NEC (or Laserwriter, they both work).  I don't know about the
>300dpi thing, if you find out please email or post.  Oh, by the way, there is
no conversion, you just load them straight in.
--
    ---------------------------------+-------------------------------------
             Mickey R. Boyd          |  "Kirk to Enterprise.  All clear
          FSU Computer Science       |      down here.  Beam down
        Technical Support Group      |      yeoman Rand and a six-pack . ."
      email:  boyd@fsucs.cs.fsu.edu  |
    ---------------------------------+-------------------------------------
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 7 Apr 91 16:52:16 GMT
From:
 noao!asuvax!cs.utexas.edu!swrinde!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!pacific.mps.ohio-st
 ate.edu!ohstpy!miavx1!rlcollins@arizona.edu (Ryan 'Gozar' Collins)
Subject: Apple StyleWriter with the ST?
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
I've been reading about the new Apple StyleWriter, which can be had at our
University for $420. I was wondering if anyone has any idea whether it will
work with a ST? All I've seen is an ad, but its supposed to be 360X360, and
uses TrueType. It doesn't have a built ASCII mode though.
 
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ryan 'Gozar' Collins      Question for MAC Users:      rlcollins@miavx1.BITNET
   ||||   Power Without    What IS the format of a     rc1dsanu@miamiu.BITNET
  / || \  The Price!!       MAC HFS floppy disk?       R.COLLINS1 on GEnie
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 6 Apr 91 07:20:22 GMT
From: chinet!saj@gargoyle.uchicago.edu (Stephen Jacobs)
Subject: BMS tape backup
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
I recently got a BMS tape backup system.  As is usual for BMS products, its
good points are superb compatibility with multi-vendor setups and incredible
support.  As is also usual with BMS products, the bad point is incomplete
software support.  Has anyone written any utilities that work with the BMS tape
backup?  Care to let them out?
                                         Steve    saj@chinet.chi.il.us
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 7 Apr 91 07:21:18 GMT
From:
 noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!sdd.hp.com!caen!uflorida!mailer.cc.fsu.edu!nu!boyd
 @arizona.edu (Mickey Boyd)
Subject: Does Lode Runner game exist for the ST?
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
In article <1991Apr3.205704.8441@unislc.uucp>, bj@unislc.uucp (Bruce Jones)
 writes:
>The subject says it all.  I would like to get Lode Runner for the
>ST if it exists.  If yes, does someone want to sell their copy?  If
>the answer is no are there any similar type games that you can recommend?
>
 
There is a great PD version from Germany called Go-Up.  If it is not on
atari.archive, I can upload it.  Please let me know if it is not.  It works
on mono monitors (I don't know about color).
 
--
    ---------------------------------+-------------------------------------
             Mickey R. Boyd          |  "Kirk to Enterprise.  All clear
          FSU Computer Science       |      down here.  Beam down
        Technical Support Group      |      yeoman Rand and a six-pack . ."
      email:  boyd@fsucs.cs.fsu.edu  |
    ---------------------------------+-------------------------------------
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 7 Apr 91 05:50:04 GMT
From:
 noao!asuvax!ukma!rex!samsung!usc!apple!fernwood!uupsi!njin!njitgw.njit.edu!mars
 .njit.edu!gaines@arizona.edu (Starman)
Subject: Epson LQ-510 printer for sale
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
I have the following for sale:
        Epson LQ-510 24 pin printer. Very good condition. Works with all
software including Word Up. Parallel and serial ports. Asking $275. You
pay shipping above 4th class. Leave e-mail for more info.
 
===========================================================================
"They can fly rings around the moon,          |          Mike
but we're years ahead of them on the highway" |   gaines@mars.njit.edu
===========================================================================
                        System 7 on an 800K floppy? HA!
===========================================================================
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 7 Apr 91 11:23:53 GMT
From: wxh@lanl.gov (William Harvey)
Subject: lzh use
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
How can I extract data from an lzh file into the directory I'm working in
instead of to the default directory the file was saved under, without
extracting each file one by one.  I'm using the unix version of lzh,
which doesn't seem to have a command to do this.
Billy Harvey    wxh@lanl.gov
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 7 Apr 91 08:11:36 GMT
From:
 noao!asuvax!cs.utexas.edu!swrinde!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!caen!uflorida!maile
 r.cc.fsu.edu!nu!boyd@arizona.edu (Mickey Boyd)
Subject: oids
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
In article <1991Apr06.191752.20596@lynx.CS.ORST.EDU>, wilsont@mist.CS.ORST.EDU
 (Timothy E. Wilson) writes:
>Does anyone know where i could get a copy of oids? I just saw it on demo and i
 want to get it now...isn't a really old game by FTL?
>If anyone wants to sell their copy..i might buy if cheap enough (10-12 bucks)
>or is it not this cheap mail-order(if i could even get it mail order!)
>thanx
>
 
I still see this one advertised in ads.  Dial some of the 1-800 numbers
and see if anyone has it in the bargin bin.  I have picked up some great
stuff for $5 or $10.
--
    ---------------------------------+-------------------------------------
             Mickey R. Boyd          |  "Kirk to Enterprise.  All clear
          FSU Computer Science       |      down here.  Beam down
        Technical Support Group      |      yeoman Rand and a six-pack . ."
      email:  boyd@fsucs.cs.fsu.edu  |
    ---------------------------------+-------------------------------------
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 7 Apr 91 08:20:48 GMT
From:
 noao!asuvax!ukma!rex!samsung!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!caen!uflorida!mailer.cc.
 fsu.edu!nu!boyd@arizona.edu (Mickey Boyd)
Subject: Pagestream
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
In article <1991Apr6.234520.27520@milton.u.washington.edu>,
 alexd@milton.u.washington.edu (Alex Danilchik) writes:
>Sorry, i should have included this question in my first posting.
>
>Question:  will Pagestream allow me to place text on a .IMG
>raster without obscurring elements of the raster definded by
>the "box" that it creates to house the text?  In other words,
>can one place individual characters of text on top of a .IMG
>file without the "text in-a-box" approach?
>
 
If you place text on an image, the only thing obscured is that which the
characters cover.  No box-like hole is created.  You can define this precisely,
using other backgrounds as well.
--
    ---------------------------------+-------------------------------------
             Mickey R. Boyd          |  "Kirk to Enterprise.  All clear
          FSU Computer Science       |      down here.  Beam down
        Technical Support Group      |      yeoman Rand and a six-pack . ."
      email:  boyd@fsucs.cs.fsu.edu  |
    ---------------------------------+-------------------------------------
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 7 Apr 91 09:35:10 GMT
From:
 noao!asuvax!cs.utexas.edu!usc!snorkelwacker.mit.edu!bloom-beacon!eru!hagbard!su
 nic!mcsun!corton!mirsa!gdo@arizona.edu (Guillaume Doumenc)
Subject: smail on Atari ST
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
I've read a few months ago that there was a port of smail for the Atari on
the way. Is it finished now, and if yes is it available somewhere ?
 
Thanks !
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 6 Apr 91 07:59:45 GMT
From: tut.cis.ohio-state.edu!n8emr!bluemoon!archbold@ucbvax.berkeley.edu (Archie
 Jaszcz)
Subject: SPC Pics from Umich, corrupt?
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
avalon@exeter.ac.uk writes:
 
> The other day I downloaded several SPC pictures from bart, but when
> I tried to view them on my ST, using a specshow programme I found
> on bart, only the top quarter of the pictures was visible...the
> rest was a mess of lines...could the files be corrupt, or is my
> viewing programme just buggered?
>
> Thanks,
> Scott
> .
 
        Yeah, the same thing happened to me a few days ago.  Some of the
spc pics worked just fine (like moonflag.spc, apollo10.spc and
apollo9.spc), but others just wouldn't load and my shower would abort.
 
        So, I guess my question is the same:  whats up with some of these
pics?
 
 
                Replies, flames, whatever to:
                        osu-cis!n8emr!bluemoon!archbold
                        archbold@bluemoon.uucp
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 7 Apr 91 07:32:59 GMT
From:
 noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!sdd.hp.com!caen!uflorida!mailer.cc.fsu.edu!nu!boyd
 @arizona.edu (Mickey Boyd)
Subject: Spectrum/3-D/animation
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
In article <1991Apr4.190424.13189@milton.u.washington.edu>,
 alexd@milton.u.washington.edu (Alex Danilchik) writes:
>Can this be done:
>
>Create a 3-D model in Sculpt 3-D, paint/render it with
>Spectrum, then animate the frames?
>
>Is there any software pacakge/integration of packages,
>that can do this for me using Spectrum?  I do want the
>advantage of all those colors on the screen at once...
>
 
I have two Spectrum animations:  one of those desk toys with the little
pendulum balls swinging (and reflections moving with them), and four atari
color monitors each with a different moving display (one even has a vertical
hold problem!!).  I have no idea how they were done.  The viewing program I
posted to atari.archive (showspec.arc, I think I called it) has an option to
show these animations.  They appear to be mulitple spectrum pics with a
sequencing file.  If you do not have these animations, and they are not
on atari.archive somewhere, let me know and I will arc and post them.  These
are two of the first demo's I ever got.  Remember "Shiny Bubbles"?  That one
sold a lot of Atari's!  The two spectrum animations are of the highest quality.
--
    ---------------------------------+-------------------------------------
             Mickey R. Boyd          |  "Kirk to Enterprise.  All clear
          FSU Computer Science       |      down here.  Beam down
        Technical Support Group      |      yeoman Rand and a six-pack . ."
      email:  boyd@fsucs.cs.fsu.edu  |
    ---------------------------------+-------------------------------------
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 5 Apr 91 18:52:47 GMT
From: noao!asuvax!cs.utexas.edu!usc!apple!bbn.com!nic!kira!news@arizona.edu
 (Robert B. Pegram)
Subject: Standardized GEM look and feel
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
From article <1991Apr4.180712.17535@uvm.edu>, by pegram@kira.UUCP (Robert B.
 Pegram):
> From article <1991Mar31.043722.10904@convex.com>, by rosenkra@convex.com
 (William Rosencranz):
>
> Much deleted...
>>
>> and if there IS a widely available document dealing exclusively with
>> programming practices for GEM, i would sure like to hear about it, whether
>> it comes from atari or elsewhere. note that i have most every book ever
>> published (in the US) on the ST, including all those which are out of
>> print (abacus, sybex, etc etc). i also have the developers docs.
>>
>> enuf said...
>>
>> -bill
>> rosenkra@convex.com
>> --
>> Bill Rosenkranz            |UUCP: 
>> Convex Computer Corp.      |ARPA: rosenkra%c1yankee@convex.com
 
Boy, it feels funny replying to one of my own postings.  I found the
reference I wrote about before.  It is:
 
 
_Visual_Interface_Guidelines_   by Frank Cohen (of Regent Soft fame -
                                                alas Regent is no more 8-()
ST Log, #28, February 1989   pp. 20 - 32
 
 
If your local users group doesn't have a packrat like myself, you
could try to get the article in 1 of 2 ways.
 
1) Contact L.F.P. Inc in N. Hollywood, CA 91615  (yes, that's Larry
   Flynt Publications - check out a Hustler for a more complete address)
 
2) Get in touch with Clayton Walnum - former editor of ST Log at:
        Taylor Ridge Books
        P.O. Box 48,
        Manchester, Ct. 06040
 
He published a compilation of his ST Log C-manship articles, and might
be persuaded to publish other things.  I'd like to see some of the
out of print ST books revived, and Claus Brod's book in English.
 
bye,
        Bob Pegram
 
pegram@griffin.uvm.edu
        or
!uvm-gen!pegram
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 7 Apr 91 07:25:57 GMT
From:
 noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!sdd.hp.com!caen!uflorida!mailer.cc.fsu.edu!nu!boyd
 @arizona.edu (Mickey Boyd)
Subject: union demo 2
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
In article <7871@jhunix.HCF.JHU.EDU>, d_alvear@jhunix.HCF.JHU.EDU (Dom Alvear)
 writes:
>In article <8216@crash.cts.com> chuckie@pro-odyssey.cts.com (Chuck Schul)
 writes:
>>[Chuckie's text (or whatever) deleted]
>
>Better yet, how about you send union demo 1 to atari.archive in an
>.MSA file and the person who has union demo 2 can do the same?  I have
>a burning desire to see some new demos.  Also, I've asked before, but
>has anybody seen the LOSTBOYS MINDBOMB demo?  I got a little taste of
>it from the RED SECTOR demo, but I want more!!!!
 
At last count, I have 9 full disk type demos other than Union and Lostboys.
If this semester ever ends, I will MSA them and put them on atari.archive.
 
--
    ---------------------------------+-------------------------------------
             Mickey R. Boyd          |  "Kirk to Enterprise.  All clear
          FSU Computer Science       |      down here.  Beam down
        Technical Support Group      |      yeoman Rand and a six-pack . ."
      email:  boyd@fsucs.cs.fsu.edu  |
    ---------------------------------+-------------------------------------
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 7 Apr 91 07:42:45 GMT
From:
 noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!swrinde!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!caen!uflorida!ma
 iler.cc.fsu.edu!nu!boyd@arizona.edu (Mickey Boyd)
Subject: union demo 2
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
In article <40919@cup.portal.com>, Bob_BobR_Retelle@cup.portal.com writes:
>
>These demos are great, but..  is anyone involved in creating the demos
>also involved in creating anything useful..?
 
Some of the Tex group are now writing games for the ST and Amiga.  They
certainly have the talent . . .
 
>We've got a wonderful body of "demos" to run on our computers, but do they
>equate into anything "real"..?
>
 
Heck, give me a pile of demoes and a good buzz any day . . .
 
 
 
>BobR
 
 
--
    ---------------------------------+-------------------------------------
             Mickey R. Boyd          |  "Kirk to Enterprise.  All clear
          FSU Computer Science       |      down here.  Beam down
        Technical Support Group      |      yeoman Rand and a six-pack . ."
      email:  boyd@fsucs.cs.fsu.edu  |
    ---------------------------------+-------------------------------------
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 7 Apr 91 08:06:20 GMT
From:
 noao!asuvax!cs.utexas.edu!swrinde!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!caen!uflorida!maile
 r.cc.fsu.edu!nu!boyd@arizona.edu (Mickey Boyd)
Subject: union demo 2
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
In article <1991Apr5.202600.7995@wam.umd.edu>, dmb@wam.umd.edu (David M.
 Baggett) writes:
>
>[.........]
>I agree with Bob.  I think it's pretty tasteless to put cheesey
>messages to one's friends in demos, and besides that, it limits the
>usefulness of the demo.  One purpose of demos is to show off the
>computer.  I remember the "walking robot" demo from Atari 8-bit days --
>I bet that sold a few machines.  But no store owner is going to put a
>demo up that says, "Howdee to all crackurs out there" or some similar
>garbage.  Correctly spelled messages might be nice occasionally, too.  :-)
>
>[...........]
>I know I've already bantered about this before, but I think demos often
>miselad non-programmers as to what the capabilities of their machine
>actually are.  You can do a heck of a lot more in a demo than you
>can in general-purpose code.
>
>[............]
>>But I agree with you, too bad we don't see more productivity products
>>from them.  I think they could write some very nice stuff.
>
>To be honest, I'm not so sure that's true.  I don't mean to be
>critical here, but many of the demos I've seen
>
>       1) simply crash when run from a hard drive
>       2) take over the entire system
>       3) provide no way to exit the program, probably because they
>          trash the OS in horrible ways
>       4) are usually weird and unpolished in their operation
>       5) rely on all sorts of undocumented and unsupported
>          hardware "features", e.g., shifter bugs, instruction
>          timings, etc.
>
>It's as though the authors only spend much time on the "nifty hack"
>parts of the demos -- the routine that puts 522 colors on the screen or
>whatever, and then just do a half-baked job on the rest.  It doesn't
>take much work to make a well-behaved program, but it requires a kind
>of discipline I guess.
>
>You can't release a productivity program with any of the above 5
>problems unless you want bad sales.  Games, on the other hand, are
>pretty much like demos in that you don't have to follow as many rules.
>
>Dave Baggett
>dmb%wam.umd.edu@uunet.uu.net
 
Dave, these works are not commercial efforts!!  Some of these kids are not
even in High School yet, for cripes sake!  Recognize these demos for what
they are:  great demoes written by pirating groups.  The messages are
programming challenges and boasts of great hacks.  What the heck is "general
purpose code"???  The general purpose of the Union demo is to amaze the eyes
and ears, and create envy toward the members of the Union.  Sounds good to
me . . .
 
As for the demoes being useless, I for one and amazed by many of them.  Very
few folks leave my house without a glazed look in the eye and a new
appreciation for computer graphics.  I LOVE to show them to PC types.  They
sell Atari machines (and Amiga machines).
 
The only thing that scares me is:  What the hell are we going to do when the
little buggers hit the job market . . . .  :-)
 
 
--
    ---------------------------------+-------------------------------------
             Mickey R. Boyd          |  "Kirk to Enterprise.  All clear
          FSU Computer Science       |      down here.  Beam down
        Technical Support Group      |      yeoman Rand and a six-pack . ."
      email:  boyd@fsucs.cs.fsu.edu  |
    ---------------------------------+-------------------------------------
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 7 Apr 91 09:59:42 GMT
From:
 noao!asuvax!cs.utexas.edu!uwm.edu!bionet!agate!cyclone.Berkeley.EDU!kawakami@ar
 izona.edu (John Kawakami)
Subject: union demo 2
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
In article <1991Apr5.202600.7995@wam.umd.edu> dmb@wam.umd.edu (David M. Baggett)
 writes:
>It's as though the authors only spend much time on the "nifty hack"
>parts of the demos -- the routine that puts 522 colors on the screen or
>whatever, and then just do a half-baked job on the rest.  It doesn't
>take much work to make a well-behaved program, but it requires a kind
>of discipline I guess.
 
>Dave Baggett
>dmb%wam.umd.edu@uunet.uu.net
 
 
Facts is facts, and the fact is, most of the fun in programming (at least
from what I've seen) is in getting the program/function to work right, and
squeezing in as many "features" as possible.  Careful design and a good
user interface take a back seat.
 
 
John Kawakami                  kawakami@ocf.berkeley.edu
Amateur Crank!                 ucbvax!ocf.berkeley.edu!kawakami
 
------------------------------
 
Date: 6 Apr 91 07:40:05 GMT
From: tut.cis.ohio-state.edu!n8emr!bluemoon!archbold@ucbvax.berkeley.edu (Archie
 Jaszcz)
Subject: Zmodem and Xmodem for VAX
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
 
fsctc@csduts1.lerc.nasa.gov (Clarence T. Chang) writes:
 
> Hi.  A couple of months ago, someone here posted a message saying that
> he has access to zmodem and xmodem programs on the VAX.  Would that person
> kindly reply to me via email, please.  I am fed up with transmission by
> Kermit and would like a faster transfer, preferrably by zmodem.  Thanks.
>
> Clarence T. Chang
> fsctc@csduts1.lerc.nasa.gov
 
        WOW!  You're not the only one who's looking for such a program for
VAX...  Whoever has these programs could kindly mail me too, or simply
post a message to the net and perhaps u/l these programs to atari.archive
(even though they're not for atari computers)...
 
        Anyway, my mail address:
 
                CE_JASZCZ@kcgl1.eng.ohio-state.edu
        or      archbold@bluemoon.uucp
 
                Replies, flames, whatever to:
                        osu-cis!n8emr!bluemoon!archbold
                        archbold@bluemoon.uucp
 
------------------------------
 
End of Info-Atari16 Digest
******************************
